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Attendance is taken purely upon #info in Zoom Chat 

Action Items

•  (Chaker Al-Hakim): Architecture Subcommittee to complete Honolulu Project Review by February 16th, by 16 Feb 2021 
•  (Tony Hansen, Krzysztof Opasiak):  

...

• Review CII badging form for OOM project
•  (David McBride): Follow-up with the requirement owners to update their "Arch Review" field associated to their req as soon as the Architecture Subcommittee will provide their "GO"
•  Kenny Paul bring Sachin from LFX team into the discussion of the Insights dashboard(s) 11 Feb 2021 

Zoom Chat Log 

05:54:58 From Kenny PAUL (LFN) : #topic roll call
05:58:11 From Ning So : #info, Ning So, Reliance Jio
05:58:54 From ONAP Meeting 7 : #info Bin Yang, Wind River
05:58:55 From SaiSeshu MUDIGANTI (Huawei) : #info Seshu, huawei
05:59:03 From Ranny HAIBY (Samsung) : #info Ranny Haiby, Samsung
06:00:06 From Jason Hunt : #info Jason Hunt, IBM
06:01:49 From Andreas GEISSLER (DT) : #info Andreas Geissler, DT
06:02:04 From Eric Debeau : #info Eric Debeau, Orange
06:02:34 From Srini Addepalli (Intel) : #info Srini Addepalli, Intel
06:02:50 From Min（CMCC） : #info Min Zhang，CMCC
06:02:52 From Dong Wang (China Telecom) : #info Dong Wang, China Telecom
06:03:17 From Olivier Phenix (Bell Canada) : #info Olivier Phénix, Bell Canada
06:03:18 From Catherine Lefevre : #info, Catherine Lefevre
06:03:21 From Catherine Lefevre : ATT
06:03:21 From Timo Perala (Nokia) : #info Timo Perala, Nokia
06:08:54 From Kenny PAUL (LFN) : #topic Honolulu Release
06:14:13 From Kenny PAUL (LFN) : #AGREED pending Arch reviews are slipped by one week due to next week's Dev Forum.
06:15:17 From Catherine Lefevre : can we refresh the agenda page
06:19:36 From Magnus Buhrgard (Ericsson) : #info Magnus Buhrgard, proxy for Ericsson
06:19:47 From Kenny PAUL (LFN) : @magnus thanks
06:25:23 From Catherine Lefevre : M3 = Code Freeze for all the reqs
06:25:37 From Catherine Lefevre : Use Case, Feature, Spec, GR and best practices
06:27:32 From Catherine Lefevre : if an use case, Feature, Spec, GR and best practices not completed at M3 then it is not a problem - these will be part of the next release candidate aka Istanboul
06:48:44 From Kenny PAUL (LFN) : https://join.slack.com/t/onapproject/shared_invite/zt-kp4nfzwn-2OJpjnZMz5X5yhQnX0zgwQ
06:52:06 From Kenny PAUL (LFN) : Enterprise Task Force: https://lf-onap.atlassian.net/wiki/x/7--6
06:53:06 From Kenny PAUL (LFN) : ONAP Slack Channel: https://join.slack.com/t/onapproject/shared_invite/zt-kp4nfzwn-2OJpjnZMz5X5yhQnX0zgwQ
06:53:18 From Kenny PAUL (LFN) : Enterprise Task Force: https://lf-onap.atlassian.net/wiki/x/7--6
07:00:00 From Alla Goldner : #info Alla Goldner, Amdocs
07:00:28 From Kenny PAUL (LFN) : @alla- thank you
07:02:13 From Eric Debeau : Hello, I must leave the meeting. See you during the DDF.
07:22:16 From Bin Yang : Sorry I have to drop for another meeting
07:22:47 From Krzysztof Opasiak : Merged Changesets is the correct metrics
07:22:54 From Krzysztof Opasiak : there is no issue with that
07:28:38 From Krzysztof Opasiak : https://insights.lfx.linuxfoundation.org/projects/lfn%2Fonap/dashboard
07:28:50 From Krzysztof Opasiak : the first metrics are LOC
07:29:14 From Krzysztof Opasiak : but the second is CHANGESETS not MERGED CHAGESETS
07:29:36 From Jason Hunt : sorry I have to drop now. see you all at the developer event!
07:29:52 From SaiSeshu MUDIGANTI (Huawei) : https://insights.lfx.linuxfoundation.org/projects/lfn%2Fonap/dashboard
07:29:55 From SaiSeshu MUDIGANTI (Huawei) : Yes
07:30:05 From Kenny PAUL (LFN) : The merged changesets in the communti leaderboard is what we use.
07:33:00 From Catherine Lefevre : 3 areas
07:33:04 From Catherine Lefevre : #1 Awards
07:33:10 From Catherine Lefevre : #2 Active MEmbers
07:33:31 From Catherine Lefevre : #3 how a person/company is viewed using lx insights
07:35:14 From David McBride : Need to drop.
07:35:37 From Krzysztof Opasiak : commits ~ any commits that are IN THE REPO
07:36:15 From Krzysztof Opasiak : Merged chagestes ~ number of created and merged gerrit reviews
07:36:38 From Krzysztof Opasiak : for commits you just go to repo and type git log --author='XXX'
07:36:51 From Krzysztof Opasiak : for merge changesets you go to gerrit and type
07:36:56 From Krzysztof Opasiak : owner:self and status:merged
07:37:02 From Krzysztof Opasiak : am I right Kenny?
07:38:22 From Krzysztof Opasiak : the problem with commits is that it includes "merge commits" and the problem with changesets is the if I cherry-picked your commit to a different branch it's counted one for you and one for me
07:38:34 From Krzysztof Opasiak : *merged changesets
07:42:32 From Timo Perala (Nokia) : Need to drop. See you all next week.
07:43:58 From Min : Need to drop. See you all in DTF.
07:44:18 From Alla Goldner : need to drop, see you all virtually next week!
07:50:51 From Krzysztof Opasiak to Kenny PAUL (LFN)(Privately) : is there any chance to see the exact git/gerrit query that is used to collect every metic?
07:51:39 From Kenny PAUL (LFN) to Krzysztof Opasiak(Privately) : I need to get Sachin involved.
07:52:30 From Krzysztof Opasiak to Kenny PAUL (LFN)(Privately) : cool. Looking forward to that I see some potential issues in both metrics so let's follow this up offline
07:55:27 From SaiSeshu MUDIGANTI (Huawei) to Kenny PAUL (LFN)(Privately) : Kenny, there is a typo on the action. I believe it should be bring instead of being ;)
07:55:40 From Catherine Lefevre : Thank yuo all for your feedback !!!
07:55:44 From Catherine Lefevre : See you next week !

...

Zoom auto-transcript service - These are often translated incorrectly and are NOT Authoritative!   Information.
Included here as a cross-reference only!  The Zoom Chat Log and the actual recordings are authoritative. 

06:07:06 And it has been enabled.
06:07:10 So we will seven people decided that we will use that going forward.
06:07:21 agenda today we'll talk about how Lulu
06:07:26 standard really change.
06:07:29 standard range of regulations are go out to Allah and Timo for being elected as the requirements subcommittee Chair and Vice Chair respectively.
06:07:45 talked about the enterprise, a little bit.
06:07:49 Talk about the grayling awards and the discussion around code merged if we have a chance.
06:07:57 And then next week's developer event anything else that needs to be in.
06:08:06 Okay, I will stop sharing and turn it over to David.
06:08:11 Thanks Kenny.
06:08:23 Okay, so just a reminder of where we stand.
06:08:33 As of Monday, we held a special TASC meeting to review the status of them to as part of the, the regular ppl meeting on on Mondays, and M to was approved, with some exceptions.
06:08:55 And there's a link there to the, the Monday meeting. If you want to take a look at the the minutes or listen to the recording.
06:09:07 But let's look at the milestone status.
06:09:18 Okay, so we're.
06:09:21 We've kept the number of outstanding issues for him to about in half since Monday so that's that's good progress.
06:09:33 So let's just take a quick look at the two or the nine remaining items. They should be mostly related to release planning and architectural reviews.
06:09:47 So you can see this one with VNF SDK, just working through some final issues with the release plan.
06:09:58 Similarly, I believe.
06:10:05 For CL I.
06:10:13 And then for the delivered items, believe these are mostly
06:10:23 architectural reviews.
06:10:26 Yeah.
06:10:27 And so, so these are reviews that have been scheduled, but have not yet been completed in. And so I want to take this opportunity to clear up a part of the decision from Monday.
06:10:44 So, on Monday. The agreement was that MTV was approved
06:10:54 with, with the exceptions, and then the exceptions would be met.
06:11:01 On February, 2, and February night we chose those dates.
06:11:08 Because of the, the schedule for the architectural reviews.
06:11:15 Since then, what I realized was that of course we have our event. Next week, which conflicts with the regular architecture meeting, and so I had an email exchange with Shukor and checker confirmed that yeah indeed that's that's problem.
06:11:35 And so, so I think if I understood Shockers email correctly all of this shifts out one week.
06:11:43 Is that correct shocker so instead of the second and the ninth it would be the ninth and the 16th. That's correct. Yeah I pushed out the reviews by one week.
06:11:54 Okay. All right, and but you're confident that they'll be completed by the 16th Correct, yeah I believe so. I think the 16th is like session I have.
06:12:06 I think we have two or three topics.
06:12:09 So, we should be able to handle any,
06:12:13 you know, any unforeseen issues on the 16th so I think we should be okay we should conclude by the 16th, you know, is it, is it the same items as DC end map on the 16th.
06:12:28 I'll tell you in a second I was going to give you an update.
06:12:31 And the second.
06:12:33 Let me check.
06:12:35 So, the question here, kidney and Catherine is, do we need to have a new vote to change this to push it out or can we just do that by pound degree or how do you want to handle that modification to the approval on Monday.
06:12:58 I would think to simple agreement is probably sufficient.
06:13:04 Okay. Yes, I agree because these were part of the exception so I believe everybody will understand that we had to readjust the time.
06:13:14 Right. I think that's my feeling.
06:13:18 Any other comments concerns about that yellow checker Go ahead, SF DC and the map are scheduled for the 16th.
06:13:28 Okay, so we can basically take this same, the same agreement and just modify the dates on these exceptions to.
06:13:41 In this section here from February 2 in February. February 9 in February 16.
06:13:49 Okay.
06:13:51 All right, any concerns or questions from the PSC about that change.
06:14:03 Right. Kenny Can you capture that. Yeah.
06:14:06 Okay.
06:14:10 All right.
06:14:15 Okay, so, so that takes care of me, too.
06:14:35 I'm
06:14:26 looking through the notes here.
06:14:31 Yeah, as, as we noted, when I pulled up the, the milestone status there, we do still have some items so we're still waiting for release planning info from Seelye so and BNF SDK.
06:14:49 So I think it's always a good target so he's any other issue on the.
06:14:54 release candidate, Gary. Yeah.
06:14:58 Yeah. Yeah, that that very well may be true I haven't had a chance to review the.
06:15:04 The JIRA in detail this morning so apologies if, if any of this has changed since yesterday.
06:15:14 And then, Catherine, there's this item with, with regard to 4430 I guess whether ci badging is applicable, or Om.
06:15:28 Yes, I was on the adjusting some notes. So I don't know if you have the latest version of the page. But the question was, for cinema, I think the CI budging beyond passing.
06:15:40 I don't know if it is applicable. And that's why I wanted to maybe as the question, because you're Miss is in GM define as impacted so maybe budging passing is no one will know Siva what you think if you are on the line or somebody from the.
06:16:01 I don't see Sylvian but discuss that in the chat during the Kyoko so Sudan was up to try to speak but he couldn't do some issues with his bluetooth headset.
06:16:17 So, basically we discussed that we believe, like 90% of questions is not applicable, or and. So, we do not see too many sense evening to get into that.
06:16:30 It's basically ci budgeting is based mostly about either stuff that and other let's say down for all my buzzer whole or for the staff that these related to the code and all I am is not really about the code but only Heron Heron charts.
06:16:51 If you don't mind I think Tony is on the bridge. I think we, we would be more convenience to my not applicable for Tony.
06:17:03 For the requirement for three which is the. Yep.
06:17:08 I had a chat with your superiors that is not applicable for.
06:17:14 Yep.
06:17:15 Okay. What was that question.
06:17:25 Tony for the requirement. Ci budging. We are just discussing that the. It's not applicable to me, like it was not applicable for the VNF requirement from thinking to market, not applicable for parking wanted to be sure that you, you see this comment.
06:17:48 I'm
06:17:48 not sure I follow why it's not applicable
06:17:55 to me is somehow the infrastructure to deploy your application.
06:18:00 Yeah. And when you look at all the current all the question. A lot of them are not necessarily applicable to oh you answer them.
06:18:13 So you answer the questions not applicable for them.
06:18:19 And, but that then does make that that's a valid answer for any given application for each of the questions.
06:18:29 Yeah, but that doesn't make sense to you know say that hey we are participating in ci budgeting and then answer, not applicable to like 90% of the question and for 10%, that is, let's say hey we're doing pretty much the same stuff as all other older projects,
06:18:47 does that, that doesn't be written the result there there are certain, there are certain aspects of the CI badging that are the quality of the application, and the security of the application then there are other parts of those ci badging that are more
06:19:06 global.
06:19:06 And so, no answer the ones for the app, there are specific to the application.
06:19:23 Accordingly, there are some of them that are now very applicable like the design for the
06:19:23 security design,
06:19:27 or how you're propagating the passwords that's something that's done and at the overland level you're creating this master password that is then used to generate other passwords, that's part of the security design social go towards the security design
06:19:42 questions. The questions about crypto agility, which is what for for, one of the things that 443 is pointing out.
06:19:52 You don't do that so you.
06:19:56 You're, you're not concerned about crypto agility at that level so you mark na.
06:20:02 The point is that you've gone in and looked at the question, and made a determination that yeah this is something that we need to look at, or know, this is something that doesn't apply or yeah we do that, it's going to be one of those three choices and
06:20:19 if it's on the side of.
06:20:22 it's on the side of. We need to do this, where we don't yet, then you write a JIRA ticket and take care of it.
06:20:30 Certainly, if you want I can go for the questions and revisit that but, you know, last night when we did that exercise with Soo Young, it was as I said, very little of stuff that was applicable.
06:20:50 If you want, we can you and I could set up a time and get together and just take a look through them.
06:21:02 So I will.
06:21:09 For now that one somehow will participate in the questionnaire. And that's what I update so at least we can close in the impact you per component, the items and then we will talk the action item that you do will give you the question and you're on both
06:21:21 part of the security subcommittee so I'm sure you will find that agreement together. Thank you.
06:21:27 Sure.
06:21:28 That Catherine.
06:21:31 Okay. All right, good.
06:21:34 So any questions about me.
06:21:41 All right, moving on to, em three let's take a look at the schedule.
06:21:49 So, just a reminder and you can see that here in the activity log.
06:21:56 We, we've pushed out at 1am to a few days, and one pushed out to the 14th, and to pushed out to the 25th, but so far we have not adjusted any of the other milestones, these are still per the original approved schedule by the TASC back on December 10.
06:22:22 So upcoming we have em three feature freeze.
06:22:29 Coming up on February 25, and Krista, maybe you can just kind of remind us what what the purposes of em three.
06:22:43 So, mp3 is basically the end of feature pool coding, so all the features that the plan to deliver during this release should be marriage, the code and review should be fired for perfectly it should be even marriage in that that would be really awesome
06:23:00 and I encourage everybody to to do it.
06:23:04 But if you do not manage to do it, you at least should have an open review for all and repost, update your image.
06:23:14 So, basically this is the point where we know, out of the scope that we planned to do. So this is what we actually managed to do. And after that time we expect that we will soon branch out.
06:23:31 We will soon create a branch in om, and then you may continue working for GE release on the features that you didn't manage to implement in this release, but now we are focusing really on a stabilization and trying to know ship, whatever we have developed.
06:23:47 So, in my opinion, I would personally recommend to TLC to stick to the dates that we have.
06:23:56 Mostly because we are shifting from scope based planning to time based planning.
06:24:06 So I, I would really, I would be really happy if we managed to release on time or the delay that we have is related to some technical difficulties that we have not, because we've been trying to you know finish the scope, with current release cycle.
06:24:24 Not many, not many. If someone doesn't manage to provide all the code on time, there was no big deal. No big deal.
06:24:34 You may see in the next release.
06:24:41 just to really sure. So somehow the empty school treat it not only for this feature right it's also fullness. What we don't equipment cool use case of requirement spec.
06:24:54 But if the people does not finish the use case, this much money to spend
06:25:01 on this video.
06:25:04 And I just scheduled for the next one I want to be sure that people do not think it's only a more feature. It's about, although the quantum the robotic.
06:25:16 The best everything, even if it is called feature freeze. Yes, exactly. And basically m three is the checkpoint for global requirements by duc de, you should have fulfilled all the goal or requirements,
06:25:29 or have an exception.
06:25:37 Because the period that we have between empty and M zero is actually to merge, everything that is pending in om review, and to
06:25:51 bring back the old containers for projects, didn't manage to fulfill global requirements.
06:25:59 Since I was wondering if we should not rename for the next few days, and to a specification freeze. So there is no confusion with spec, which is the spec feature.
06:26:14 And maybe the name feature freed by code three so people do not think we only freeze the feature, it's really the container of the Hindi, just a suggestion so we don't make the terminology.
06:26:28 With the requirement name or type requirement died with the milestone.
06:26:35 Yes, it makes sense to me right. The only reason why you shall eat was called feature freeze, is that if there is a bag that is discovered during our NOC cycle.
06:26:47 Then we really want to get that marriage, right. So still bug fixes, or something, acceptable to do for this release after mp3.
06:27:04 Okay.
06:27:05 Thanks, Chris.
06:27:09 Okay, so the next question you're gonna ask me is where are the tasks. And so, Christoph and I will be meeting later today to go through the release management tasks for both the projects.
06:27:29 And then the requirements, and so I hope to have that sorted out with Christoph today and then I will try to publish the M three tasks, either by tomorrow or Monday.
06:27:53 Let's see.
06:27:57 Catherine there's a note here about architectural review status in the release requirements here can you just click on the link, David, if you don't mind.
06:28:09 It's a question that fo shocker for no money.
06:28:22 This is a little bit all dice roll, so all the items have been approved for one and then two, but I know, Shaquille you you did some progress with the architectural review.
06:28:27 And I was wondering if we could also update the equipment. Accordingly, because I guess the first three have been probably already been updated.
06:28:40 While we are still architecture review not yet perform.
06:28:45 It is the fourth column on the screen.
06:28:50 I'm trying to the screens too
06:28:57 too small so I'm trying to read I'm trying to understand what the question is. Just give me one second.
06:29:02 So,
06:29:07 is the Ganga dashboard where we try to track the progress of the requirement it's the requirement page. And then if you remember we had the one colon which is the fourth one, related to the architecture of review.
06:29:23 And I was just wondering if we could also reflect the status.
06:29:29 I think adding the EUUF been performing for the requirement itself. And and I guess the first page is probably been already, if you just use cases yes they have been reviewed.
06:29:43 So, let me see I think the two questions over here one is
06:29:50 to answer the immediate immediate question as to whether you use cases have been reviewed and the answer is yes.
06:29:59 And I lost the screen.
06:30:05 Okay, the answer. The short answer is yes and the second, the follow up question is,
06:30:13 I think it's an ask for me to update this column, as we go through the architectural reviews. Well, I, and I would disagree with that and that that wasn't my intention my intention was for the requirement owner to update this column.
06:30:31 Once they pass the architectural review.
06:30:35 I like your, your idea David.
06:30:39 I like it a lot.
06:30:41 So I'm 100% behind it.
06:30:44 Yeah, can we up the David in the future. They be dentist open checker, can we add them a task for the owner, the equipment owner, as part of their milestone, to, to update.
06:30:59 Indeed this for media, and one that I don't know. So you can see, you can see they didn't follow through all the way so you can see here's the here's the architectural review and you can see that it's been closed, but they didn't follow through and update
06:31:18 that field.
06:31:20 So, yeah, I will take an action item to reach out to the requirement owners and ask them to update that field.
06:31:33 Is it the stuff that we also need to cook in the future, and again I spent time on this table details because we really prototype with this release the next release cadence.
06:31:44 And I want to be sure we don't miss anything in the future. So maybe we should also have a task and wanting to, depending on on it is key because usually the requirements should be the view before the ppl made the commitment about them.
06:32:02 So I tend to see more and one task and the code.
06:32:09 And I, what is the task I mean we already have tasks to schedule a, the requirement of this stuff should have do review.
06:32:21 If it is already there, it's great. Yeah, it's already there.
06:32:25 What I need to do is pay closer attention to the staff set field and remind requirement owners that they need to update that field when they.
06:32:34 It's in the, it's in the procedure that I wrote for completing the requirement gyrus, but I will, as I said I'll, I'll reach out to these requirement owners and make sure that they complete
06:32:57 the architectural review field.
06:33:02 Okay, good.
06:33:04 All right. Any questions about Honolulu's status. Again, our next milestone is coming up on February 25.
06:33:16 That's am three feature freeze and Christophe and I will be working on the.
06:33:25 Release Management requirement. So those should be published by close of business on Monday at the latest.
06:33:38 Alright. So moving on to Glen maintenance release. So, As you're probably aware.
06:33:50 We.
06:33:52 I sent out a request for the projects to complete this this table.
06:34:00 And it's been mostly completed, we do still have a couple of items missing, and I haven't been able to go through this in detail today.
06:34:17 But this together yesterday so this some of this may have changed, but at least as of yesterday we were still waiting for some information from music project.
06:34:28 Om, and then.
06:34:32 So if those teams if you're on this call if you could complete the table that would be helpful.
06:34:40 Also, there's a
06:34:44 row here the music project, and there's a question about the the the ptl. It seems to me that someone told me a while back that they had been touched in touch with the music project, and that they were going to participate in doing maintenance work.
06:35:04 Is that correct or am I miss remembering that is anyone know status in the music project.
06:35:18 And so then, from my perspective, the music project is in madness. I hope we can give you the project statements. After the elephant events. And currently, I don't know if there are still some active commuters.
06:35:35 So the, the primary issue here, if I'm understanding correctly, is the certificate update. So the question is, is if, if there are no competitors, or ppl available from the music project to do this.
06:35:52 Can someone else step in to handle the update of the certificate.
06:36:02 And I guess what what is the what is the consequence if this certificate is not updated
06:36:15 consequence if the TV guys motivated, if people are using in the production environment, music, and they have not replace the certificate by the company certification, and they are still using the old one, the component that they will be an issue when
06:36:34 the certificate will expire.
06:36:38 So people have an option to replace with their company certification.
06:36:44 Or, then they need to a new themselves with a new own app certification and contribute back to the community. So I don't know how many companies are currently using music.
06:37:00 I understand that the music is embedded in of, if I remember well.
06:37:07 So I don't know if it's really impacting a lot of Krishna. I know, probably the OSD was already looking at photo identity, but I don't know, That's something we should follow up with Krishna, Krishna you're on the call, do you want to comment anything.
06:37:29 Yes, Catherine so as you said we are looking for some alternatives, but like, we don't have any strong alternative self now.
06:37:42 Let's see.
06:37:43 So is this for the maintenance release right there certification certification certificate expiry already.
06:37:51 Yeah, there's a maintenance release.
06:37:53 Yeah, okay.
06:37:55 So will this impact the next release to like give the certificate is expired So will it impact the hitch release to.
06:38:11 I imagined it would be, because I think that the certificates are updated on an annual basis. Correct. But Krishna, one point is the such with it a bit perseverance to let him in the same but the Lord we change that even the software experts like after
06:38:19 90 days or something you still can update it later on also.
06:38:23 So the procedure to update the certificate will not be changing at all.
06:38:29 Yeah.
06:38:36 lot to the community to the people the companies are using music.
06:38:42 If they are volunteers to make it.
06:38:46 Otherwise, we need to review the status of music so I just would like to launch a call for volunteers to look at it, and I suggest that really discuss this topic in particular.
06:39:02 On February, 11, why, when I will present the result of the project management Task Force.
06:39:08 That would be my suggestion.
06:39:12 I want to just add one more point.
06:39:14 Till we have alternative music maybe we can proceed with the, with the such we're extending that is actually one good option.
06:39:21 Because, as I know of. Also, it's very tough to replace music completely because we have a hard dependency on on on music from both deployment as well as from usage.
06:39:32 So my question would be to Krishna to, to use that, I mean do you use some, the head and the helm charts and other things as it is right now you're changing it and also expand extended certificates for time being, can we find a proper alternative music
06:39:48 which can fit in. As with all aspects.
06:39:53 Yeah, I agree.
06:39:57 tissue. Yeah.
06:40:04 and we can take the help of integration team I can also sit with you for that to external certificates we got that task is actually common across one that it's not specific for any anything like music.
06:40:13 So we can learn it, I can truly help you with this, we can learn how the music is using this application we can do it together if you want I can also extend your help for that because I suggest we can use music as it is.
06:40:24 Once it goes once it's been noted that we are completely taking it off the rail and it's very tough to bring it back.
06:40:29 So, let's not wait for till then Krishna so let's try to do it and as I also help you for the certificate extension if you want.
06:40:37 Yeah, sure, sure.
06:40:39 Thank you. Thank you father. Yeah, We can work it out.
06:40:42 as information how do we go about doing that.
06:41:02 So I don't think it's given anybody to update any components, including AFAF is governing members, the objective was to replace it with the
06:41:16 mesh if I remember well there was a PLC but probably we probably need to follow up.
06:41:23 If indeed.
06:41:24 That will be the path for what are the ways we can always have a call to the community. If they are company, while using it, maybe we can resume as that's also part of the project management.
06:41:46 Task Force proposition to resurrect a component in maintenance.
06:41:49 If there are some company interest with.
06:41:54 But, but all of the components and lm to have implemented the certain assert initialize or container to retrieve certificates is using AF is a client of yours, but I'm not totally sure that EF is already using that, except for itself.
06:42:15 I'm not sure that the semi big I say something. I'm not sure, as is already using the self defeat to satisfy your analyzer, because I think it was introduced, after he was in my notes but maybe mobile dancing.
06:42:33 You may you know better than I do, or maybe Crisco.
06:42:38 Yeah, so if I make comments
06:42:43 regarding the service message to see. Yes, that's true. And we still believe that it's a path forward. But we are unfortunately still working on that.
06:42:52 If anyone is interested in helping, obviously, please come show at a meeting and join us. We are always happy to accept help. And regarding the AF and the updating certificates, there were there was actually a patch in, em, that externalize certificate
06:43:12 data from AF. So, as you know, in order to add for example a service to to a database he previously you had to release a new a new image.
06:43:25 And now with the solution that we have in the patch.
06:43:29 There would be just a configuration file that would leave within the entry. And then to update the database you would no longer need to release a new image, but only modify a file that is in all Enrico.
06:43:43 So that would be a temporary solution for now to make sure that we are able to update their update certificate data without actually releasing a new version of a so that that does a temporary solution for long term solution we are still targeting service
06:44:01 mesh.
06:44:02 Okay.
06:44:04 Okay, maybe Christopher's might want to talk to you offline and related to make sure. Thank you.
06:44:15 Okay.
06:44:16 As I mentioned, we're still trying to collect a little bit more information in particular, we're trying to nail down when this will be completed. And I noticed.
06:44:30 For example, Om.
06:44:32 We don't have an estimated date for you yet.
06:44:36 And then also, that that project.
06:44:43 So if those projects that are available on the call right now. If you could fill in that in missing information that would be helpful.
06:44:53 Well, David, the thing is that from our own perspective, we cannot set the date of completion. It depends, I guess.
06:45:04 On the other projects. Yeah, that's a good point. Yeah.
06:45:10 So I'm a capture that.
06:45:26 Okay.
06:45:28 All right. And, is anyone from bed available.
06:45:38 The other thing I'm curious about is that we have a few projects that had, like, cc SDK DCA the map.
06:45:53 Isn't integration
06:45:56 and SDN see, so that the their estimated dates have already passed or today, in this case.
06:46:12 So are these dates still accurate I did you actually complete what you intended to complete.
06:46:18 Yeah. For cc SDK we completed everything except we need to Well, two things we need to update the release notes and the CDs you I certificate still needs to be refreshed and first DMC there was no certificate refresh so we're done, just have to update
06:46:33 the release notes. All right.
06:46:42 For so I already mentioned the comment there we have already made first release on Colin, and we are done by end of February.
06:46:51 Sorry. By the end of, when
06:46:51 I told you to mention all 28 February. Yeah, I read that as 28 January. Okay, I see that now. All right.
06:46:58 Thanks for the correction.
06:47:00 Okay.
06:47:02 All right. Um, so, anyway.
06:47:08 I sent out an email to the affected projects that we're still missing some data from. So, if those projects could complete this table that would be helpful.
06:47:22 All right.
06:47:24 And I believe that's, that's the end of the release status and was there any questions, any questions about Honolulu or Waylon maintenance status.
06:47:40 All right, Kenny I think I'm done.
06:47:47 Okay.
06:47:49 Next up, we have
06:47:56 up here.
06:48:08 Okay, hopefully folks will see that, yeah I can see mostly that you can see it
06:48:22 about using rocket chat.
06:48:26 As a reminder that server will be decommissioned on the 31st.
06:48:31 The link in the minutes and I will drop it into the chat window will allow you to join
06:48:41 the LFN.
06:48:45 Sorry, the only Slack channel that has been set up.
06:48:51 Were there any issues that anyone have regarding
06:48:57 release engineering tickets.
06:49:04 Nothing urgent that I have right now but the issues that we were facing earlier in the week on the brigade fight and support for Python two has been fully dedicated so
06:49:21 there were few.
06:49:24 There were few lF tools installs there. So we the predicted those and it should be fine right now.
06:49:33 Okay.
06:49:37 No there. There was a Nike ticket related to the Sunday mind what's the app called Jessica
06:50:00 is
06:49:51 for sonar sonar Yeah, thank you. Yeah, there was a there was a lingering sonar ticket when we talked about this last week I believe did that apparently that got resolved.
06:50:18 And, yeah, I haven't heard anything else regarding that. So is there any.
06:50:10 Is there any questions on on that ticket I I closed it because I didn't heard anything back.
06:50:17 Yeah, I'm trying to recall which project that affected.
06:50:36 It was the guy, and I think I come from
06:50:33 the place that you provide, just the gas will coil, I
06:50:39 believe on the phone. Yes.
06:50:40 I'm just checking I don't see bill on the bridge, but we, there was the conclusion on the radio, management, ticket. So thank you again for all your support and your guidelines.
06:50:54 Okay, great. Thank you, Jessica one review spending for so new project request, maybe I just want you to review it back to the one that I that I commented, it has it has field corrections needed to have recommended recommended.
06:51:12 Okay, I'll take it today right now.
06:51:22 Moving on we already talked about requirements subcommittee.
06:51:30 Enterprise Task Force.
06:51:32 Catherine anything you want to talk about there.
06:51:37 Yes. Would you mind to click on the link.
06:51:45 So just wanted to remind people that we have set up a task force to focus on the usage of an app for the enterprise business as a staff we were trying to have the weekly call, we have our first kickoff meeting, if I remember well on the 20th, so he probably
06:52:07 was already uploaded said and I were providing or feedback from a carrier perspective, above all, we, we were thinking about possibly possibility of who nap was passed away in the novel, where we could use own up to serve enterprise business.
06:52:30 We had some additional info, we were thinking to maybe come back the Shang one and young one.
06:52:38 The there is a topic that they will present during the DVR event, about own obstacle for investigating this pre so somehow we connected as well.
06:53:02 problems from under five business differently.
06:53:06 So, before moving deeper.
06:53:10 The idea of a survey was something that we also discuss with Kenny was the most convenient, and I wanted to take the opportunity of the call because I can reach a broader audience to get additional feedback on the soap to kick off this, this, This task
06:53:34 force in a way that will be meaningful for the community, and also for the enterprise business that you are serving as well.
06:53:49 And the other items, we had was to reach the big chair.
06:53:54 Because you ag chair represent all the carriers to understand what would be the requirement for their, their customer there on the fly business or customer.
06:54:11 And I know can he was taking the action as well.
06:54:14 And as you can see Ellen Chen, who is a former own up the members of peek over new on a new company. A couple of years ago dedicated to as scare.
06:54:28 And that was also another ID, that was shared during the kickoff of the phone up for enterprise business.
06:54:39 The items in green are probably the past, we definitely implement as well as conducting a eulogy, even if it is not highlighted, other stuff.
06:54:50 Any other folks from the THC or anybody on this call.
06:55:06 Okay, so I will have a dedicated session on this topic, during the DTS event again to try to bring our awareness that we would like to diversify the usage of own up to not only orchestrates DNS DNS DNS, but also be used in the context to support on the
06:55:33 And maybe collect some questions, which will be also be passed on the survey.
06:55:41 If there is no interest. Then of course, we will approve the task force, and he pushed accordingly to the elephant board, but we want to try a couple of weeks on in this space.
06:55:55 Because we had the n double some time we have a slow staff.
06:56:01 But at one point if, if it is not the right time for companies to come to focus on this space, or if they're already it on a diff.
06:56:11 I prefer to redirect the task force to something which is more relevant to your activities as own up committee members
06:56:24 disappoint which I just want to sit through the current political candidates and enterprise usage not be better suited for the carrier.
06:56:37 So maybe be required to actually revisit that you add razzing the current news team but usually requires like a specific department had a revisit based on if you want to get that it was Kelly is giving enterprise feedback from the lights
06:57:16 the concern that was raised.
06:57:19 Was that the composition of the EAG is being, Considering that it is primary primarily terriers may make it difficult to actually get effective input from folks in the enterprise space.
06:57:41 So that's one thing, building the survey, and then promoting the survey is something that at the FM level, we will need to partner with them on.
06:57:57 And we don't want to limit
06:58:02 the calories. Right, I'm sure. Exactly.
06:58:07 under five business, you know, there are a lot that we can offer.
06:58:14 Because for me, it's one platform. And I always like to challenge that one platform can be used for multiple folks right, it means having a control mechanism, it can be applicable beyond what we are thinking today.
06:58:31 So the US was really what was triggering my mind when the elephant board was asking me the question, but also we have been really progressing greatly.
06:58:46 Thanks to a lot of you in the next slide thing.
06:58:57 Why you are already in mind that the slides could be Nikki Nikki dedicated to IoT you know the slide could be dedicated to gaming. So, in this mood, we are tackling a little bit of space, but I'm sure we can do more.
06:59:04 And that's why I don't want to limit the people who are using owner. Just two people who are selling solution or people who are carriers, I think we really need to talk to onto the pies.
06:59:21 People, and maybe we can have access to enterprise business but via, all of you, because as so party vendors, I guess.
06:59:31 You are not only selling your solution to carriers like offense, but probably a two to the scare and another under five business so I don't want to, that we are limited.
06:59:45 Otherwise, our way of thinking is limited as well.
06:59:51 Yeah.
06:59:51 I think one of the key areas here it's going to be the actual communication, the survey when it's developed.
06:59:58 And that is something that elephant can help out quite a, quite a bit.
07:00:05 will engage Brandon on that, and the team and in trying to get the word out so that we can get some good input.
07:00:15 That would be fantastic.
07:00:17 So again, I will have the similar discussion during the DBS because the DFDDF somehow it's a great windows to target a broader audience. And after that be the best for us, we will develop the survey.
07:00:34 Accordingly, it open for volunteer.
07:00:38 I'm also open to have a different session, it for targeting people who are living in inner back and the EMEA.
07:00:48 If these regions are interested to participate to the task force because I realized that the time selected was selected by the people who subscribe to the CNS platform.
07:01:00 But in order to boost this task force, and also to understanding their interest faster.
07:01:06 I'm also open to every session in the afternoon and morning European Time Zone.
07:01:14 But I would only do that if there is an interest.
07:01:19 Right.
07:01:20 Okay. I think that's what I wanted to bring to this for home and see me now.
07:01:29 So please be discussed during the DDS as well.
07:01:32 Thank you.
07:01:38 Okay.
07:01:42 Well, some people are transitioning now to the community awards last week's
07:01:49 meeting there were questions that came up about how to measure code merged.
07:01:57 Is there any action to be taken from that.
07:02:05 But I was looking at the. I didn't reply to the mailing list and again, my. But before I share my phone, I would like to give the floor to the TASC, to see if there's any type of opinion and then I will let you know what I was thinking as well.
07:02:22 So, if any team members would like to provide feedback on the question which was raised over unity. We were following beat Ohio.
07:02:35 The way whole Beto, are you was displaying the top contributor.
07:02:41 Today we are using analytics.
07:02:44 If you look at lF analytics.
07:02:54 During the period of building.
07:02:51 For me does not really make any difference for the first two, because the first two if you look at the number of commitment, commit the number of line the number of 10 said.
07:03:12 They are definitely the first two. Now, the, we might have a debate. for the first.
07:03:12 So candidate.
07:03:13 And depending on all you review the the tours, you might have different, different answer.
07:03:21 So.
07:03:24 So again, if, if the spirit of via one way is different than the sale by another way.
07:03:34 Let's be open.
07:03:36 We didn't have a watch in a while, and I was about to suggest.
07:03:41 Let's speak the next. Right.
07:03:45 based on the combination of all the possibilities. So as you can see, the first two whatever you look out the first to the debate might be between the third and the fourth.
07:03:58 And the idea is really to recognize contribution value contribution made to this community.
07:04:06 Because I know a lot of companies are doing a lot of additional service on top of own app.
07:04:13 But there will be no community. If we don't have contribution directly to our repository.
07:04:19 So again, we can extend, we can review, you the rules and be more accurate for the
07:04:30 good in what's next.
07:04:34 Now we are doing good.
07:04:40 Oh no, you're yeah sorry I, I'm a little bit busy today. So, again, I said I will not see any more common and finally I start with my phone. What's the feedback of the DNC because we want to recognize people, we don't want to make people happy.
07:04:55 So that's, that's actually the thought that we should recognise the merit.
07:05:00 One concern which we have right now, identified, which me and Christophe were talking last week was that the code must as we say is not actually been taken into consideration we are taking change set.
07:05:11 So they can change set for the number of contributions is not right fit.
07:05:18 We can take the commits or the code or in the code is actually most right actually lines of code is much more appropriate to be to be more more precise and that's exactly what it means by code much, but also we should consider reviews actually that's
07:05:31 one more thing I would say, but the current aspect is change sets which is not a great thing to actually measure the metro under medical students what I would say.
07:05:41 2000 change that he thinks that one can one day. Yeah, and for one call me, and I'm not saying that it's bad, it's nothing bad right in om, we tend to send for example, you have 40 or 50 different change sets for for a single comment because we are you
07:06:07 know, trying to get the gating right, etc. Some fixes that that's not an issue for us but the thing is that maybe it's not the most accurate way of measuring how much that would have gone, you have contributed to all right.
07:06:23 And because this this criteria is for contribution measurement, it's not changed it's not right for it, that's exactly what we are trying to see
07:06:32 you.
07:06:33 And do we need to readjust the tools, because the salt when we were discussing into the 90s, you see was the our world, really.
07:06:46 we should look, if there are the pre we should organize the top three and not necessarily the six seven which has been promoted. We want it to rely on the tools so at least there is no debate.
07:06:59 Behind the scenes, when are the words have been made. So that was really the logic we use the tools to equalize the people
07:07:09 So in that regard. Yeah, sorry for the interruption but, and in that regard, how we've always measured it has, has always been using the change set. So, if there's a if you guys want to do it differently.
07:07:26 Just what is that what is that model you want to use Do you want to use lines of code. At this point, sorry for interrupting on this point code much has not changed sets, we will have to be clear that I'm, I'm not arguing the definition.
07:07:47 What I'm saying is what we have always done.
07:07:49 No, but that's that's the point we're trying to say right the code mashed and and the chain set are two different aspects, we cannot could use them interchangeably, right.
07:07:59 So, what we have been using is commits or code that is ok but change that is different aspect altogether so we are getting confused with code most and change it, and we are using them interchangeably, that is a point which we are trying to raise.
07:08:10 We are okay with the statement there the code match is absolutely fine that's actually good criteria. Okay better than change it, I would say, to create to to measure the contribution.
07:08:19 But if you are using change it instead of code mush, then that's a shoe.
07:08:25 Kenny.
07:08:27 The question. Are you sure that in times when we've been using by meter Jia.
07:08:32 We've been also using change sets metric. Yes, absolutely.
07:08:37 Okay, because I remember that at least the homepage, that the landing page that you had.
07:08:43 When opening. Yeah, exactly. Okay, that's for our own statistic.
07:08:54 Only cases were used right. But even now, even though you could go to the homepage, if you go to our lesson and it is comprised the first page will be commits the first page.
07:08:59 The first dashboard which you land up will be commits.
07:09:03 Yeah, you did you saw the the it's actually number of commits at 347 473 is actually number of commits, and then restaurant it follows down.
07:09:12 So the initial place where you end up landing is like the language, the language for the dashboard is actually commits.
07:09:20 Right, Kenny.
07:09:24 It says change sets know you can go to, you can go to homepage again and you can learn it again that's what I have seen this last one when I saw it it was commit
07:09:35 the change that has been linked, that if you follow the link which has been given for the selection part that yeah that's Lance you to change this but if you just land to the homepage of the elephant networks last month I'm saying it was commits.
07:09:48 And that was the same case with even the Bible JIRA.
07:10:02 now you see commits.
07:10:08 You see, in the same people. So that's why I said to me.
07:10:14 We are okay with people actually.
07:10:17 Yeah. Yeah. Thanks for disappoint
07:10:25 difference for this one right if the name were different.
07:10:29 Maybe I was open to extend because as I said, we, we took time to read us resumed is our word on the eye of the TASC we all believe that it's important to recognize the contributor.
07:10:44 In the name would have been different depending on the methodology for this award.
07:10:50 Honestly, we could extend right now, looking at one aspect to the other as you can see the same name. Nevertheless, I want to take in to consideration.
07:11:01 And again, I really wanted to see to speak up because of the feeling I'm driving and this is everything, which is okay as a chair, but I don't want to impose my point.
07:11:11 I think you should make a proposition. And then we give you the proposition with a TLC, and I would like to have the proposition next meeting on the 11th and discuss on eight with a PDF.
07:11:29 Why, because I want to inform.
07:11:31 I think it would be great to inform people, how we will merger.
07:11:37 This particular hour for this. Is it fair, or does anybody else minutes modeling for Honolulu, it's for the elections
07:11:49 for the election.
07:11:53 Because we should we should not have a different criteria for measuring contribution.
07:12:01 Yeah.
07:12:10 I understand that. Guys, I thought we were only concerned about the year. We were only concerned about the hour, but never the contributions.
07:12:16 Catherine does shocker So, and I think the the other sensitive area that we are point that we need to keep an eye on is how these results are going to be interpreted outside the own app community.
07:12:35 The sponsoring companies will look at the results, it will interpret the results and may interpret the results in completely different way.
07:12:48 So we're going to be sensitive to the fact that these numbers and I'm not suggested that we do anything with the numbers but we need to be aware that how these numbers can be interpreted by the sponsoring companies, and whether they would have impact
07:13:05 on participation or not.
07:13:14 So, so, from an absolute number perspective.
07:13:36 You know I you know the numbers are what they are right but we need to be aware of the fact that misinterpreting the numbers could have some consequences on the contributions to this community.
07:13:36 Yeah, that's exactly the point we should make right absolutely absolutely I get your point.
07:14:00 Right, right, in absolute count of the contributions is not an indicative of how critical the contributions were.
07:13:58 And I know Dan and I know see shoe and I know all the, you know, most of the people that are on here.
07:14:03 So, so we got to be aware.
07:14:09 Right, of what the count means internally versus how it's going to be interpreted externally.
07:14:24 Okay, so now that I understand better on the concern, and my apologize, I saw that it was just a problem with the award. Now I understand that its impact on the election so I'm sorry I've missed this phone did you make it clear today so I'm glad we have
07:14:32 this conversation.
07:14:35 My initial souls. And again, it's only me.
07:14:39 I'm only 118 Person of the one flesh. 18 parcel of the CFC.
07:14:47 I think we need to be aligned with the other projects, because I don't know how they perform their election, if we change what it is already agree at the second level, we might have a different issue.
07:15:00 So Jason, are you still with us, is it something we need to generalize for each of the project because he will not be doing one way and then I don't know Open Daylight doing another way, then it can take a conclusion.
07:15:17 How do you feel about that easy the tech of you.
07:15:22 Second discussion, or is it up to the project to decide what they want to do or how do you see it.
07:15:28 I think it's up to the project to decide what they want to do.
07:15:32 And we just have to be sure that the insights tool here can support the, the break reporting that that we want.
07:15:41 I mean, does it really matter if
07:15:44 if each project chooses a different metric I'm not sure.
07:16:02 We have tried to unify our minds. The wheel we are underlying the life cycle of the elephant project. So I just wanted to be sure there is no need to unify our minds, this copy the way how we are electing TLC members, definitely did come up in the last
07:16:21 tech meeting, and the consensus was that tack can recommend, but each community is free to choose their own methodology and metrics.
07:16:33 Okay, well I probably missed this.
07:17:00 Okay. So, we don't need to add to the, to the sack. Anything we can be completely autonomous, are you getting this but then we need to
07:16:50 review that so maybe we could secular an offline discussion with the CFC members, because they are responsible about the TC composition.
07:17:00 That could be passed on the TC to the discussion that we have doing the DBS, but it's it's a valid request, please by your community, that we should consider.
07:17:14 I think. Hi. Sorry, this is Allah. We do have a discussion that we cry the dedicated discussion you are additive on your video.
07:17:26 Moving forward so perhaps, perhaps the best is that indeed office remember think prior to death and then you know we have a structured discussion this strongly support the point raised by tracker you know eventually, it is not unlike a community of let's
07:17:45 say you know those writing applications for iPhone or whatever Android. you know via community of the members of the people, driven by their companies.
07:17:58 Right. And so, in any structure that we are pushing for, we need to take it into account and so you know we have said many time the elections should be individual and but but still, you know, they should strong to keep in mind that it is a company objective
07:18:14 that we are fulfilling each one of us is fulfilled in here, and hence you know we should make sure that any of the results let's say will not potentially reduce a contribution and an interest of the companies to participate.
07:18:30 And you know as I also mentioned during some offline chats that we had a few weeks ago, I think that the results of the previous rounds were, you know, Aaron youth participation by several members that we had.
07:18:45 And this is in my view, by far proceeds over any as a goal that we may or may not have for the elections that we make sure that none of the members, you know, reduces his participation, or company participation our prime goal is to increase participation
07:19:06 of three inches.
07:19:07 So I think you are
07:19:10 speaking in the direction that we want to go, which is this topic should be part of the TSP composition, how we build the next year c team.
07:19:23 And of course it will also depend on the, what we call the active membership.
07:19:28 So I would suggest that all the DNC members, prepare
07:19:34 in this direction so at least we we have an idea about what how we want to move, at least to define on the active members of the owner community that will be probably the first one of the first items that we need to answer.
07:20:16 the standard definition of that right same as conditions for, to see compositions without a definition on the active member. So I guess the question is do we want to revise the definition of a keep the definition for all of those points like
07:20:15 yes i i think the current active community definitions are okay they might need to be clarified a bit. But what I'm showing here is, there is what's been measured.
07:20:31 We don't have measurements for merged commits.
07:20:36 We have measurements for merge chain sets. And that's what's been that is what's been measured for all of the elections, and all of the awards.
07:20:48 Up to now, so if if we want to change that that's fine. But the important thing to know is that thus far, it's always been measured the same way it's always been measured by the same yardstick.
07:21:01 If we want to change what yardstick that is, that's fine.
07:21:06 And so the merge code has always been this value here.
07:21:13 But I must score does not change that.
07:21:16 I'm not arguing, definitely.
07:21:19 But, hey, session, but but but stop for a minute. If we are talking about marriage change sets, then this metric is actually correct.
07:21:31 No, marriage.
07:21:34 The marriage.
07:21:37 But basically, pretty much, decode that you contributed for Garrett, right, and the only difference between marriage change sets and comments should be with the number of non trivial March comments that you have pushed without Derek.
07:21:56 The word does a shocker again right. The numbers are what they are right, at least from my perspective.
07:22:02 I'm not, I'm not disputed the numbers. That's not the point that all right numbers are what they are.
07:22:09 We could look at the absolute numbers. And we all can determine come up with the same conclusion, the top number associated with the top, you know, top person, you know, obviously I mean, you could interpret it the same way I would interpret it and anybody
07:22:25 else would interpret it but that's not the point that I'm making the point that I'm making is.
07:22:32 This has to be the entire results would have to be weighted by a Impact Factor on the rest of the platform.
07:22:43 You could have one person that has two commits where their impact is significantly higher than what the numbers indicate
07:22:56 how do we get to a point where we can derive the Impact Factor from the numbers that we from the absolute numbers that we're tracking. I don't think you can because I think the impact factor is a relatively subjective measurement.
07:23:14 Of course, of course right but the end, and if we have, if, if we are measuring the subjectivity, rather than objectivity.
07:23:30 Then we've got. I think we've got a significant problem in terms of determining who is an active community member.
07:23:39 Yeah, I hear your point no question about it but look at it from a company perspective, a company that is involved in assigning resources to own app, and that company works on one feature I'm just giving you an example right one features that is very
07:23:58 very critical. They have a very few commits, and yet the impact of significant, but that does not show in these reports.
07:24:10 Yeah, but what do you want that we know that, I understand. That's why we're, we're debating the issue right, I understand. Yeah, it means that we need to start to put away on feature to say oh yeah this feature it's something that it will be definitely
07:24:28 the next trends for the industry for both become very complicated that that's really an incomplete, very complicated.
07:24:38 It's,
07:24:41 it's not always that complicated. It's impossible to instrument.
07:24:47 You cannot put instrumentation in place to measure that.
07:25:00 I understand I didn't, you know I you know initially I made the point that this is not easy, right, but if you look at it as a member member company, and you spend significant resources on a specific release.
07:25:17 And you don't have a anything to show for it, based on this report.
07:25:24 Then you have to question as to what your impact as a company is to this community. So what that measurement is, is, if it's an important feature. Every time we do our release.
07:25:41 There is a blog or a press.
07:25:45 And the most important features and the most important impact is always highlighted in either that, press release, or that blog post.
07:25:57 Right. And, and, and that is something that is the result of input from the TLC.
07:26:09 I felt that we were having several lessons discussions here. And I want to unwind, I think, Kenny, your original triggering was when we move to the artifacts, I did something change we measure change now.
07:26:29 Now we're still measuring measuring the same thing, right. So, exactly. Yes we are.
07:26:35 Okay. And one last week was that folks, not that that the way we are measuring isn't great.
07:26:50 So that's why we need to see the different discussion I think I would suggest that the DNC members. Think about what has been discussed today.
07:27:04 And then we will resume with the DNC members the discussion of the video, as it was blonde, girls, it's, it's impacting the TSP composition,
07:27:16 or not sure it's worth binding the things together. I mean, there is a discussion about what is TC should do and as a valid discussion that Shakur raised about how to measure contributions that are not necessarily lines of code.
07:27:35 And both conversation should be had.
07:27:38 We have and I'm not sure they're related.
07:27:43 So it's worse because. To date, the mind, if you are an active, an active community members, you are looking at different criteria. That's all about the
07:27:59 community member is a binary thing once you pass a certain threshold you are an active community member and the threshold is not very high. I don't think there's an issue, issues.
07:28:10 I think it's a valid issue that chakra raised is. Okay. How do you like recognize contribution that are not lines of code, which is during, we were considering Java, we were considering it's not only about code the way how we were murdering Jarrod, a
07:28:42 wiki. Is that a lot of things in addition to just code.
07:28:36 The challenge that that chopper has brought up is measuring the impact of contribution versus what's just measured.
07:28:58 And what do you are do you do this, because one feature for one company can be definitely important one for 10 older, it does not make any sense.
07:29:09 Right.
07:29:18 So, reveal. So there is no way that we can make movies together like contributing your very good technical proposal to to wiki, or, I don't know, changing 2000 lines of code to improve some functionality.
07:29:32 I mean, there will never measure up so we need, as I think Kenny suggested to find other avenues to expose these non code contributions.
07:29:41 That
07:29:45 is funny, and also be reflected in the tools because everybody's using the tools to understand from contribution.
07:29:56 Okay.
07:29:58 Thank you, honey and feedback.
07:30:02 Both me and session posted a link to the dashboard that we've been referring to.
07:30:08 And the problem is that, in, in the second, the first metric is obviously the lines of code. Right. But the second one is not lines of codes commits also Christophe.
07:30:23 You're talking about commits. So if we go to the landing page.
07:30:29 So here it says, Dr and contributors by comments, and then the metric that you have in the table, says lines of code.
07:30:39 Right. There's both of them there's lines of code.
07:30:47 The order is completed the pie chart.
07:30:48 Okay. And then the second metric. That is the problem.
07:31:06 Below below scroll all the second dashboard your second dashboard.
07:31:06 Here you see pull request came sets. But those are, you know top 10 contributor bus by change set, it means the number of changes that you have to send the review know those that emerged.
07:31:12 And also it includes a request. Both of them are not the criteria, right.
07:31:24 So chances are Sufis, right, and actually pull request and change set and change sets are not interchangeable. Because who will request, whenever you updated.
07:31:29 It's still a single pull request. But whenever you update a Gareth review, you get a new change set right so those are those are pretty much not the same things.
07:31:42 And I missed. what is displayed here is not what is used.
07:31:49 What is displayed, but let me go back. What is played and the leaderboard.
07:31:55 Okay.
07:31:58 looking at
07:32:01 this report gets pulled down.
07:32:05 And what gets looked at
07:32:09 is what is in emerged Kinzer
07:32:17 that maybe we could just speak to the previous dashboard and make it, just to show the same metric.
07:32:24 Because maybe that's where the confusion is coming from.
07:32:33 Perhaps we can we can do one more thing. Maybe we can just take it offline as Catherine was saying maybe we can just take it offline to see whether how these things are coming but most comments is actually a better career and change itself and what say
07:32:46 instead is much better than actual change itself, that's for sure. But my other thing is, I was coming different from most sense Jensen.
07:32:56 That includes marriage comics, right, commit does not
07:33:02 know much you've seen commit only, I mean if I abandoned something it's not concerned the most is that work.
07:33:13 Merge, if it's if it's yet.
07:33:18 Okay, but you're only referring to those things which are most commits. It's a very committed but include not just too much commit, is that right good understanding, you know, this is, this is, this is the only value that I have ever looked at right there
07:33:34 that I have highlighted.
07:33:47 So, I believe that the value that can is looking at, is that correct one. Mark. Yeah, it really will reflect the I understand that oh yeah I'm just trying to understand that Christophe to make it clear I just want to understand this point i think that's
07:33:50 exactly what you're also asking right like they commit IV referring to all the converts into the abandoned once then surely that's not the right criteria much since since it is truly the right creative and then we have to look at the dashboard which I
07:34:01 was pointing to earlier session, let me explain this. So indeed, you have two types of comments. One of them have single parents and those are the standard comments.
07:34:12 And the second has two parents, and those are merge commits right, the most common. Right. And for example, in om whenever we marriage your patch. The American comic is being created.
07:34:29 So, for example, you have created a change set, right, and this is counted in marriage change sets for you. But whenever I merge your change. I'm creating emerge call me in om repo, and that is.
07:34:48 Yeah that's called cherry pick one so you
07:34:48 know I'm coming,
07:34:52 I'm coming there. And what am I asking here is, what am I trying to understand here is by commits, are we referring to every commit that is including the ones which are abandoned the ones which are not it merged the ones which are terrific are all those
07:35:06 all those constraints commits.
07:35:18 Nope.
07:35:18 Only
07:35:13 commit.
07:35:16 I think you see a little confusing it's already there, even if you are all experts.
07:35:22 So I would like to recap the problem. We need to single whatever change or if you create the right one it's applicable to be our.
07:35:33 All we assess some, some of your words. The second aspect is all we did our mind, an active member, and it's not so complicated because no money when you do 20 of these things you're already an active member with a key domain where are you are our concern
07:35:47 is how you are perceived as an individual as a company based on the inside data, and again disease is not only for own up. Right. It's also for any other elephant project to write them free I mean convinced it's a mobile attack issue that the non issue,
07:36:06 because if we start to be conscious of dashboard, from Open Daylight from, I don't know what it will from any of these open source project, it will be a nightmare.
07:36:17 Honestly, right, because we cannot be different because an executive when he will look at own app will not have the same understanding when he will look.
07:36:28 Open Daylight, it's very, very complicated. Nevertheless, we have to consider all the concern from our community. But I think if I would like to add that is honey because he was already thinking we are eating different issue.
07:36:45 So is it hard to say we have one issue with the award that we can easily to fix under market. We have the problem of active members will impact the TLC composition, and we have the old persona companies you using an x.
07:37:01 And that's hot to be sold as a hook throughout labor that just all all.
07:37:08 Because if we change something just to own up an old elephant project people's identity as not the same meaning how a person will be informed that all data here is not the same meaning.
07:37:21 then the data, data. Is it correct so Ronnie did I categorize correctly, or do I missed. Another category. I really would like to get it going to as category for the problem we try to address.
07:37:35 I think it comes through the categories where I just need to comment that I don't necessarily agree that it needs to be the same for all elephant projects I mean, each community values, different things.
07:37:47 And it's perfectly okay to highlight what our community values, whether I don't know if the fighter community only values lines of code that's, that's their right to so but I don't think we should align with that if we value other things.
07:38:03 Yeah so so I 100% agree with what ranting said the individual communities can place value on different aspects of the challenge that Catherine's raised here is, we can't have different dashboards for different projects.
07:38:24 Yeah, that's my point that's really my point because otherwise you need to have an editor saying for community. We are doing this. And that's exactly.
07:38:34 Yeah, exactly. And this is exactly the reason that the board exists. That's the reason the leaderboard exists because the individual communities can go in here and look at the raw values that matter to them.
07:38:52 Okay need to pretty simple. I think that that the dashboard which is being referred to, we can actually change that the landing page can be committed, the most committed self, I'm in total machine sets itself, that will be more appropriate.
07:39:04 And then we can take the commits and also listening space so we can actually value what is being considered as the criteria.
07:39:11 And we can actually project the dashboard accordingly right on the other issue which we have the main issue which we have is a confusion coming up from the dashboard, which shows the change sets and commits, but the criteria is commercial commit much
07:39:25 sentences which is not there and as part of dashboard.
07:39:35 Kenny.
07:39:37 I'm, I'm.
07:39:41 I'm thinking
07:39:44 merged.
07:39:47 Their there on the on the landing.
07:39:53 Get these are not reflecting merge is one below. Yeah, one below and this this is commits this commits and vandalize chances.
07:40:02 It's not much.
07:40:05 Right. Yes, exactly.
07:40:10 Yes, it's right.
07:40:22 It's a totally different from what most come to me naturally right so that is one criteria which be required to be phrase, so we can put this as a top one, which is what is our contribution Mark if that's what we want to show, I mean that's exactly what
07:40:24 we want to show that we can put this as a dashboard landing page, which is just genuine filter right i mean once we have admin privileges which is can change the filter and that should be fine.
07:40:42 Okay, what I would like is for someone to write up exactly what they believe the measurement should be
07:40:53 and respond to the email thread.
07:41:02 It is already in the Tsu list.
07:41:06 Chef because I need to change, I need to convert that into a requirement for the insights team to do the tool.
07:41:21 And also need to make sure that it's something because these.
07:41:26 The whole point of, of having this setup and of moving to insights, is that it can be leveraged across the entire Linux Foundation.
07:41:40 Right. So, if Huawei wants to see exactly where they're where their contributions have been measured exactly the same way across other exactly the same, because not everybody's using the same ci tools.
07:42:01 Right.
07:42:03 Right. from Gary that might come from GitHub fabricator whatever. Yes. And can you and also the views right here is that you're putting together pool requests from geek cup.
07:42:22 We've changed says from Garrett, and when you are updating a cool request. Number is not being increased in this metric. But when you are updating a guaranteed review the number is get increased.
07:42:30 So now, depending whether areas in GitHub, or Gary for development, this metric will look very different. Can he just make it simple, who is the right candidate for discussing this is the focus behind so there should be some code which is going on right
07:42:49 i mean between all these filters so who is the right candidate for us to discuss that.
07:42:53 I can, I can get.
07:43:00 Okay, because there are some questions marks here, especially with the, I mean. Thanks for clarifying on the machine says that is pretty clear. But the problem which was coming up first with the dashboard.
07:43:10 And the dashboard shows. Pull Request versus change sets and that's where the confusion is so better we can discuss with respect to what does actually mean the word can actually the label can mean something else but actually we want to be sure of what
07:43:24 is the code or the exact script which is running behind to make sure we all on the same page.
07:43:42 That should be really helpful. Can you to control this faster.
07:43:35 It makes sense.
07:43:39 Yep.
07:43:43 I will get that scheduled for the first meeting I can get it and maybe I guess on the 11th I can try putting into.
07:43:53 The other thing would be to review comments also say me because we can, we will commence are also contributions, so I would also suggest to add to what can we solve for to watch soccer and Ronnie was just saying something sometime before contributions
07:44:10 you talk about the contributions, or right here. It's right there.
07:44:11 It's dead said but I'm thinking the dashboard, we don't have it, so that's not like we don't even consider them for the contributions right now right as part of India contribution yes I do.
07:44:20 Yes we do. Yes we do.
07:44:22 Yes we do. Okay. Oh, my bad I'm sure if that's considered and it's great.
07:44:31 Okay, so I just wanted to validate if you agree with a ti we need to tackle one if you're worth which seems to be not too complicated. The active membership is probably extremely key because it, it will be important to define the Ts, the people who can
07:44:54 meet addicted for the PSC competition.
07:44:57 And then we have a border discussion where we will need to see if we can ever be drawn dashboard than anybody else.
07:45:12 And I believe we can back because people need to be informed we want to learn from anybody.
07:45:22 So sorry for interrupting. Yeah. Sorry for interrupting I just want to clarify one thing that if it's only made much sense that which has been considered, then it's just a problem with the dashboard and other things all fine the way we are having the,
07:45:32 the, the contributors are the way we are actually contribute we are actually measuring the active active contributors for the criteria for Tsu or anything else is still valid.
07:45:42 Because merchants and change that is actually valid but the problem which was coming up was the display or Tony dashboard problem.
07:45:50 I guess I don't understand why that is a problem, if we are measuring based upon the leaderboard for our community. Those are internal.
07:46:05 The problem is skinny that not everyone will be able to filter it out. The only thing was they see when they land in this thing is what is being shown.
07:46:09 Okay, so we have a different criteria from what is being shown, then the companies may ask to come to the what Allah was saying or what chatter was saying, people may actually have a different representation for that.
07:46:20 So let's try to keep, I mean that's it's better to keep what we are trying to measure as a part of contributions or what we value as a contribution to community as the right measurement on the dashboard, and to resolve all the issues right and to show
07:46:32 something else and to measure something else.
07:46:35 Whether I'm hearing that we're all in agreement that the way we measure active contribution is okay nobody has an issue with that, yes, and the way we measure we identify the leader is is also ok for boards and so on.
07:46:48 And the only issue I think and we all agree we all feel we need to improve is, is the third item that, Catherine highlighted that means, what do you put on what do we put on the landing page of the dashboard and how do we highlight we've seen so that's
07:47:04 where the discussion but for the first two I think we're okay no need to. Yes, and thanks Can you for clarifying it, so we are good death. Exactly. That's tensor running and running for clarifying it better and thanks Can you for clarifying it on the
07:47:15 first place that we are only constrained the merchants it not as we show in dashboard.
07:47:20 So to clarify to what Catherine was saying we only required.
07:47:25 The expert to elephant to come over to just make sure that we are taking the right code. I mean, right, I can say statistics for machine that. And then the rest of it would be only changing the dashboard to reflect to what exactly as is my, these are
07:47:38 my machine criteria. Right.
07:47:43 We communicate in the dashboard because I just want to tell you a concrete example. So, there is an at&t executive who know these tools, as an example, right, and he's really interested to know what is the contribution of Easter party vendor eight.
07:48:01 Okay. Yes, is not part of your nap community is not part of the Open Daylight community is not part of the CMT, but he knows this tool is accessible.
07:48:12 Any look at the data, right here we look, I don't know what maybe the comment maybe the company name, usually they look at the company name by the way, contribution.
07:48:21 If we start to differentiate, of them. Right. This executive from at&t was looking at company, we not had any ID that for all of it is different, right and that's really my point because that's what the exact is doing.
07:48:38 They look at the tools they rely on the tools, and they look the same way.
07:48:44 CNTT and we'll get Open Daylight on up. So if we, if we don't have this discussion at one point of attack. The people who are really doing the decision of Google.
07:49:00 Right.
07:49:00 It will have an open discussion, it's about. I want to be sure that an individual company is clearly reflected. Right. So, you're absolutely right. The executive needs to know the real impact of companies and individuals, not an arbitrary metrics.
07:49:19 So if the big contribution to own up is, I don't know Wiki pages, then your executive should be able to look at their own up dashboard and see which company contributes the most Wiki pages, that's just an example.
07:49:32 Okay. It makes no sense for him to follow an arbitrary metrics that is the same for all projects but it's meaningless for owner.
07:49:43 It's more important. Executive we'll have, we'll have an understanding of who's really contributing to them.
07:49:51 And that's why it has to be written on these tools, because if we change the way how we do things, these exact that I don't know who is it will maybe not contact me, will not know that own app is doing something different.
07:50:07 You see my point. So, so that's why it has to be in this.
07:50:15 Some way. So, so this is exactly the reason I made the point earlier. Right.
07:50:20 It is the same executive, he or she could look at the results, or at the dashboard and look at the amount of resources that they dedicated to own app, and try to make sense of what the dashboard shows versus how many resources, they think they're contributing
07:50:45 to, to own app.
07:50:49 Money will also compare with other projects so that, that's why we need to be clear.
07:50:55 You cannot view. If we change something, you cannot you own apply your project because otherwise it will be misleading if we change anything. And that's why I was bringing it to the second issue, because we need to inform the fact oh by the way on up.
07:51:09 We don't want to do that anymore. Explain why we don't want to do that anymore, because the person who access to these tools, usually they don't only look at one project.
07:51:20 They look at all the projects where the person knows, so fast the vendors are contributing, but not only one dashboard. And it's not spelled go. It can be confusing because that's what my point.
07:51:35 I think we can change whatever we do, but if it is not written some way a person which is not familiar with all the discussion we have today will continue to see the same thing because he compare one project to another one.
07:51:55 Anyway, I think these are all great discussion, there is definitely a concern that we need to address. I'm glad that we are on the same page for item one into.
07:52:06 And we might want to continue to the discussion on the item pre.
07:52:12 The action point to calculate and pre will be to have the lF inside team to explain the details behind the dashboard. is it okay as a summary.
07:52:25 Next step.
07:52:28 Yep.
07:52:30 Okay, yeah.
07:52:33 Gimme.
07:52:34 Just click on action that we need the LFX insight theme, sending us all the park, some data.
07:52:43 But having a meeting with us.
07:52:47 Thank you.
07:52:48 Sorry Kenny, I will also send you a mail I think we had discussed this earlier, but it's not not directly related to that but the problem of the association between our contributors of dt, to the to our kind of common DT company would be nice.
07:53:05 I will send you a message and then we discuss about that maybe then in a separate call, yes, the affiliation is a, is a different beast and I did notice that after the data got brought in from the GA that suddenly it was, we had an aggregated and it was
07:53:23 desegregated when it came in.
07:53:26 Yeah, I'm a just inform you that you keep this in mind, and I sent you that email. Correct, yeah, that's perfect. Thank you.
07:53:42 And thank you, don't add to this I will discussion because we have a vibrant community and we want to be sure we are addressing any concerns. So at least.
07:53:52 All of you continue to support this on our community and and have many ladies in front of us. So thank you so much did we cover all the items we wanted to discuss thing we are running out of time so I just want to thank again Big thanks to honey Timo
07:54:09 for the elephant developer, even big thanks to all the speaker in advance, have a look at the Schedule page. And I want to also ask people to take few notes, each time they do a presentation of people attending a presentation.
07:54:26 So we get Sure, we capture a few notes for the daily summary so it is my life when I had to do the daily summaries because I know what you have appreciate what was the key items.
07:54:38 So, please help me to be agreed daily summaries.
07:54:44 When you attend, or when you are presenting something.
07:54:47 Thanks a lot. Yes, I think if you go down.
07:54:52 We should proceed with subsection under each topics but that's where we need to talk. Yeah. Somebody just needs to add a new line under oh now, when they are searching.
07:55:13 I think it would be a very great event to kick off this year, with all the other communities.
07:55:23 Okay. We are nearly a full half hour over.