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Attendance is taken purely upon #info in Zoom Chat 

Zoom Chat Log 

06:00:14 From Keguang He(China Mobile) To Everyone:
    #info Keguang He, China Mobile
06:00:16 From Andreas GEISSLER (DT) To Everyone:
    #info Andreas Geissler, DT
06:00:55 From Dong Wang (China Telecom) To Everyone:
    #info Dong Wang, China Telecom
06:01:05 From Cédric Ollivier To Everyone:
    #info Cédric
06:01:14 From Ram Krishna Verma To Everyone:
    #info Ram Krishna Verma, Bell Canada
06:01:34 From Paweł Pawlak To Everyone:
    #info Pawel Pawlak, F5
06:01:35 From Dan Xu To Everyone:
    #info Dan Xu, Huawei
06:01:47 From N.K. Shankar To Everyone:
    #info N. k. Shankar, Individual
06:02:05 From Timo Perala (Nokia) To Everyone:
    #info Timo Perala, Nokia
06:02:51 From Martial Ngueko(AT&T) To Everyone:
    #info Gervais-Martial Ngueko, AT&T
06:03:33 From N.K. Shankar To Kenny PAUL (LFN)(Privately):
    On a phone. May lose coverage at times.
06:08:44 From SaiSeshu To Everyone:
    #info Seshu, windriver
06:18:10 From N.K. Shankar To Everyone:
    We have not been able to find a PTL for OOF.
06:19:28 From Kenny PAUL (LFN) To Everyone:
    DCAE committers: Tony Hansen, Jack Lucas, Tomasz Wrobel, Niranjana Y, Shuting Qing
06:20:28 From Kenny PAUL (LFN) To Everyone:
    AAI committers: Manisha Aggarwal, James Forsyth
06:22:19 From Kenny PAUL (LFN) To Everyone:
    OOF committers: Sarat PUTHENPURA, Vikas Varma, Arthur Martella, Shankaranarayanan Puzhavakath Narayanan, Dhebeha MJ
06:37:02 From Kenny PAUL (LFN) To Everyone:
    #VOTE Does the TSC approve rescheduling London M1 to December 15? +1, 0, -1
06:37:05 From Paweł Pawlak To Everyone:
    #vote +1
06:37:10 From Timo Perala (Nokia) To Everyone:
    #vote +1
06:37:10 From Andreas GEISSLER (DT) To Everyone:
    #vote +1
06:37:12 From Keguang He(China Mobile) To Everyone:
    #vote +1
06:37:12 From Cédric Ollivier To Everyone:
    +1
06:37:16 From Dong Wang (China Telecom) To Everyone:
    #vote +1
06:37:16 From Ram Krishna Verma To Everyone:
    #vote +1
06:37:19 From Martial Ngueko(AT&T) To Everyone:
    #vote +1
06:37:23 From Magnus Buhrgard, Ericsson To Everyone:
    #vote +1
06:37:27 From Dan Xu To Everyone:
    #vote +1
06:37:42 From Kenny PAUL (LFN) To Everyone:
    #endvote
06:38:09 From Kenny PAUL (LFN) To Everyone:
    #AGREED the TSC approves rescheduling London M1 to December 15
06:40:59 From N.K. Shankar To Kenny PAUL (LFN)(Privately):
    On a phone. Coverage may drop.
06:41:07 From Kenny PAUL (LFN) To N.K. Shankar(Privately):
    k
06:57:02 From Cédric Ollivier To Everyone:
    BYW they're many release jobs missing when reading the clean patchset.
06:57:36 From Cédric Ollivier To Everyone:
    I think the patchset tittles are misleading. Else they seem good
06:58:16 From Cédric Ollivier To Everyone:
    @Pawel: Does Jakarta is still maintained?
06:58:24 From Cédric Ollivier To Everyone:
    Is..
07:02:34 From Paweł Pawlak To Everyone:
    IMO not as we have had Jakarta Maintenance to fix Log4j issue, so Kohn=N, N-1 = Jakarta Maintenance, am I correct?
07:03:50 From Fiachra CORCORAN (EST) To Everyone:
    Not sure how up to date this page is but..
    https://lf-onap.atlassian.net/wiki/display/DW/Long+Term+Roadmap
07:03:51 From Cédric Ollivier To Everyone:
    ok. The ci-management patchsets can be merged safely. I would recomment to rename the title which is misleading.
07:04:54 From Cédric Ollivier To Everyone:
    I will dive into the tox issues. it works here in similar env.
07:05:55 From Kenny PAUL (LFN) To Everyone:
    https://lf-onap.atlassian.net/wiki/x/j-X7
07:07:42 From Kevin Sandi To Everyone:
    Thanks for the +1’s, @cedric do you mean the title of each Gerrit change I shared?
07:08:23 From Tony HANSEN (ATT) To Everyone:
    New top level projects also need to create and fill in an OpenSsf badging questionnaire for the project
07:08:39 From Cédric Ollivier To Everyone:
    I do disconnect. sorry
07:09:30 From N.K. Shankar To Everyone:
    Have to drop.
07:12:32 From Sandra Jackson To Everyone:
    I need to drop.
07:14:58 From Kenny PAUL (LFN) To Everyone:
    #VOTE Does the TSC approve the creation of the Portal NG as a new ONAP project as defined in PortalNG Project Proposal ? +1, 0, -1
07:15:00 From Andreas GEISSLER (DT) To Everyone:
    #vote +1
07:15:02 From Magnus Buhrgard, Ericsson To Everyone:
    #vote +1
07:15:02 From Paweł Pawlak To Everyone:
    #vote +1
07:15:07 From Ram Krishna Verma To Everyone:
    #vote +1
07:15:11 From Keguang He(China Mobile) To Everyone:
    #vote +1
07:15:16 From Timo Perala (Nokia) To Everyone:
    #vote +1
07:15:17 From Martial Ngueko(AT&T) To Everyone:
    #vote +1
07:15:36 From Dan Xu To Everyone:
    #vote +1
07:15:59 From Kenny PAUL (LFN) To Everyone:
    #endvote
07:16:48 From Kenny PAUL (LFN) To Everyone:
    #AGREED  the TSC approves the creation of the Portal NG as a new ONAP project as defined in PortalNG Project Proposal 
07:16:53 From Tony HANSEN (ATT) To Everyone:
    See https://bestpractices.coreinfrastructure.org/ for the openssf questionnaire and https://lf-onap.atlassian.net/wiki/display/DW/CII+Badging+Program for discussion of it
07:17:04 From Kenny PAUL (LFN) To Everyone:
    Thanks Tony
07:18:06 From Kenny PAUL (LFN) To Everyone:
    #AGREED removal of OOM helm charts for appc, vid
07:30:20 From Kenny PAUL (LFN) To Everyone:
    mainstream mailing list to join: https://lists.onap.org/g/onap-mainstream

...

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06:03:46 Transcripts turned on
06:03:51 And let's get going. I'll start off
06:03:54 Hey Kenny, I'm also green
06:04:01 Okay, madness, thank you
06:04:04 Me too
06:04:11 Me, too, Kenny, I'm green.
06:04:13 Yeah, okay.
06:04:23 Okay. so we will start off by
06:04:28 Running through our antitrust policy.
06:04:34 Oh, this is important, or we have multiple companies participating in these meetings, please review if you have any questions, please contact your Company's legal Council members to the left, Me also Contact Andrew up grove Firm Gesmer Upgrowth, Llp which Provides, Legal Accounts to the Lf which We're
06:04:51 looking at is the Full and Trust Policy as opposed to the little truncated version that we normally have in the Slides keep yourself muted
06:05:06 Let's get going
06:05:10 So continue discussion on on app consumers how well, this is something that started conversation last week, We've got the M.
06:05:25 One scheduled for today for London. David would be going through that touch on
06:05:35 Touch on Lf I T. it's been some Conversations, going on about the Portal Ing Project, that Deutsche Telecom Wishes to Contribute I put some Slides, Together, on that to Help Hopefully Clarify Things, the Dca E Ptl
06:06:01 There were no responses to that. So we need to talk about that Magnus to see that put in something for on statement.
06:06:11 And Talk about the Upstream and then Standard, Housekeeping, Anything Else.
06:06:15 I think, Fiatra also proposed some discussion, point and decision point for the Tc.
06:06:23 So Chat, are you okay, if we discuss this phone today.
06:06:27 I I didn't. I didn't have permissions to update this page sorry I didn't have permissions to update the page.
06:06:33 Unfortunately, so I did not as here, but I sent an email with request to add it to the agenda.
06:06:35 Yes.
06:06:37 Yeah, that's okay
06:06:37 Okay, didn't see that
06:06:40 So the request is to to have agreement from the Tc.
06:06:45 On removal from oem and hand, chart, some projects that are Maintained like up.
06:06:54 See Portal, and beat right
06:06:57 Yeah, I, think, we we we had a quick discussion around Portal.
06:07:01 I think there is still a dependency on portal for Sdc.
06:07:05 So I think the Appse invade would be the initial candidates.
06:07:09 Yeah, among a few.
06:07:14 Yes, so potential Gain is obviously, the you know if those projects are not participating in the release, there is no point on losing resources on it.
06:07:26 And probably now dial the Scope of of the Test, and so also I think this is important decision to to focus on the important things total up right and not you know having this blue lines on what is in Scope. And what is out.
06:07:50 Okay, and just as a data, point, you should have had permissions.
06:07:57 To edit it. sometimes what'll happen is it'll log, you out, and but you'll still it'll still look like you're logged in I've had that happen on gazillion occasions
06:08:08 Yeah, I did. There are some there's strangeages with with confidence for me at the moment in terms of permissions to view items, etc.
06:08:16 So I'm not sure whether that's a general thing, the people are saying.
06:08:20 But yeah, like, the London requirements, page. I can't see the Gs. For some reason.
06:08:25 I don't know where that's it's not loading, for me I'm not sure
06:08:27 Okay, yeah, so that's that's definitely gonna be a sounds like a login thing,
06:08:35 We can talk about that, after the call.
06:08:48 Okay, Powell, how would you like to proceed in the order, here, or something else
06:08:52 Yes, yes, I think we can move with disorder.
06:09:00 The first point is simple and straightforward, so I don't like to have some slots available in the agenda even not today.
06:09:11 Even if It's not today in one of the next tsses to have on up consumers sharing with us the Feedback as We Discussed last week.
06:09:20 So I, encourage you guys to to book slots for the upcoming tsc meetings, so we could know the feature.
06:09:29 We could steal our activities, and priorities. Yeah
06:09:37 Okay, do you want me to add, to put that into the as a standard slot for the agenda, template, or just for the
06:09:47 At least at least for the Agenda, Template, for the December and January, because I I will petition.
06:09:53 Okay.
06:09:55 We cannot, you know we should concentrate on on Collecting Feedback, and then agreeing on the Actionable Items and priorities.
06:10:07 Okay.
06:10:03 So as I wrote in my Email, maybe having December, January Timeframe for Collecting Feedback, and then agreeing on the on the next Steps, and Actions.
06:10:15 Yeah, hi, I will. I agree. December will be more about collecting it.
06:10:20 And then January, I can also put up a session from another side. Yeah.
06:10:24 Perfect. But thank you very much. Hello.
06:10:34 Okay.
06:10:44 Okay. Should we dive into London?
06:10:55 Alright, thanks Kenny
06:11:06 Alright let's start out reminding ourselves about Schedule Oops, one, there we go
06:11:17 So you might remember that
06:11:21 Oh, back in November when we're evaluating Cone
06:11:31 We had to slip cone, and we didn't want overlap milestones with the London release.
06:11:39 We yeah, also slipped the London Release, one week, December eighth today.
06:11:49 Which you can see here and then that's the Last Mile Stone, that will Evaluate for the Calendar year. And we won't have another milestone to look at until second half of January.
06:12:07 Alright looking At Milestone status. Unfortunately, we didn't make as much progress as I hoped we would.
06:12:17 We're still up only about 50% projects
06:12:24 A little over a little less 50% for the requirements, some of this is due to the fact.
06:12:36 We had a number of requirements. So we're submitted late
06:12:41 That just received their release management, tasks, also I wanted to point out that we we now have a couple of projects here that are lacking Ptls and this is contributing to the slow Pace closing release management asks on the Projects and I'm really
06:13:12 Looking for some guidance here from the Tsc On on how you'd like to proceed.
06:13:18 So for example, we have a and AI, and also dcae both which recently lost their ptls
06:13:30 Yeah, to, my, yeah.
06:13:30 So question are there any commuters in this Project that could act as a you know as a person, front front man for for us to to take care of those tasks or decide projects like abandons that there are no committers, and then it should be it, should be moved to the unintended because
06:13:51 Well, I think that's the next step. Isn't it?
06:13:54 Kenny, if there's no Nominee, then the program managers, Z email to the the list of Committers to see if we could find a Ptl, is that correct
06:14:13 Yeah, and for Dean, that's been done
06:14:21 In phoenix AI
06:14:25 Alright don't recall seeing anything for an AI
06:14:37 In that. Regard. But that doesn't mean that it wasn't sent
06:14:45 Is anyone
06:14:45 Would you please check Kenny for this, because we should treat each and every project in the same way, according to process, right
06:14:52 Yep.
06:14:58 Okay, And then, you know, we have a long running issue with the Om.
06:15:06 And Integration, although th that's been off somewhat because those projects are actually active and have people working on them.
06:15:22 They just don't have a ptl and so my approach there, typically, is just spam the the list of committers.
06:15:34 And eventually the tasks get done But obviously it's not as ideal as having a ptl, and then of course, one I Missed is oh, F.
06:15:46 Which you know Krishna needed to change.
06:15:55 Had some changes in the as
06:16:00 Priorities and had to back away from own app fortunately, he was able to finish most of the work for the Cone release but I don't think we have any Expectations of Any Contributions, from him.
06:16:21 For the London Release,
06:16:24 Now at at 1 point I think it was Shankar.
06:16:34 I think we had been looking into the possibility of an alternative Ptl for a Of that I don't know that that ever went anywhere.
06:16:43 So so my point is is that we have open release management.
06:16:49 Tasks, for Number of projects, Without Ptls and some not quite sure how I should proceed here.
06:17:00 Should we just ignore these release management tasks? Do we need to halt, the the the release process until we figure out what to do or you know how how should we proceed? Here.
06:17:14 Good, yeah, at least for for for integration, and for
06:17:21 Or oh and of course I will take take the responsibility and I'll do that in the next case, right?
06:17:28 So, yeah, so, these both you can ignore.
06:17:31 Yeah, so I officially as the Ptl.
06:17:34 I will do that I didn't have time to look at this beforehand, so
06:17:39 Okay, are are you stepping up to be the Pt home?
06:17:42 Is that what you're saying
06:17:45 I'm doing, anyway, much of the Pt, a work.
06:17:49 But I don't want to be officially assigned as on ptl for that so but I will do anywhere.
06:17:54 Doing, the All, the the gyr stuff, for for oh, and or most of the of the Issues.
06:18:02 Here. And I'm I'm I'm doing this as well, continue that, but I won't be of an official ptl. So I'm not and talk, but I Don't have time but as well.
06:18:20 Yup.
06:18:09 Yeah, and I. And as I said, that You know it's been less of an issue with the omb btl, because the projects are active but they they just lack ptl, so they eventually get around to doing the tasks but we don't have that situation I believe with and
06:18:32 AI and a Dcae at O. F.
06:18:38 I I don't think we're going to
06:18:43 Unless someone steps up. I don't think we're going to get any Activity out of those projects for London
06:18:48 David, My proposal is to is the following, Please Contact, the active, Contributions, or any contributors, I mean committers in those Projects, and talking about Dca AI, oh, if If They're Able to Provide those that are Able to Execute those Release Management, Tasks, with some Deadline I Don't
06:19:13 know next Thursday, or something right, and we will see if the project is capable of doing it, or not right, and then we will take this decision.
06:19:22 I don't think not right. Now. We have a discussion.
06:19:25 I'm not Having Ptl or not, but rather executing those tasks right?
06:19:29 You should be working with with Right
06:19:32 Right.
06:19:34 Yeah, so we have we list of committers. Thank you, Kenny, for sharing.
06:19:55 Right.
06:19:38 So we need to contact them to see if they're able to execute those tasks, we are not at the right now in the position of asking them, to be Pt because even if they would like to be pt they would already raise their hands right as they did not do it so it means that
06:19:58 we we need to focus on executing those release management tasks.
06:20:03 I mean the discussion with some, you know third party companies to be on board with to Own up and Maybe Support.
06:20:12 Integration, you know, to give us some qualified resources to contribute to our app but I stay tuned.
06:20:21 I will show some more details. When I have some. Some you know agreement with with those folks to to support us.
06:20:30 Okay, I will,
06:20:32 Hey! Paul, this was Jay. Yeah. Just want to add, right, so, yeah, so I think, Kenny, thanks for sharing, the computer list.
06:20:40 For DC, for London, I know there are some new proposals or enhancements coming up which has already been discussed in the DC Forum.
06:20:49 I think what we are lacking is the Ptl going forward.
06:20:53 I I was hoping somebody else would step up, and I can make sure I can transition in terms of what the Expectational response would be for Ptl is but especially we don't we don't have any anybody. Else.
06:21:03 Nominate, yeah, for really spending some of the tasks are shouldn't take more. Time.
06:21:08 I mean, I can certainly help with, the for the M. One, but I think if you look deeper into it.
06:21:15 There is an architecture. Review meeting to be scheduled, but then what in terms?
06:21:19 Of what, New Architecture, transformation will be those are something, the new Ptl, or the New Act 2 Computers, sure to side and and then propose that for Architecture Team so Requesting a meeting I mean I can certainly send an Email, and I'll, have to have the Scheduled Chucker, but
06:21:37 Who will be contributing more and doing, the Architecture Planning for DC, going forward.
06:21:46 It would make sense for them to present that to the architecture for right.
06:21:48 So I think that's that's where I I feel I think we have a gap.
06:21:53 Now the
06:21:54 Yeah, makes, sense,
06:21:57 Thank you vj. So whatever you feel you could move forward.
06:22:02 So please help us in this. I understand that for maybe for architecture review, we need to have some of the committers agreeing on doing it it doesn't mean that we have to be automatically, because might have some other obligations.
06:22:19 But maybe somebody would volunteer on running this particular task, right I'm pretty sure of Support from Shaken and you will be provided to to to to go through it.
06:22:32 Do you expect some significant changes in the architecture, for the DC, or it's just saying that they nothing new
06:22:39 I mean from the Proposals we reviewed there is no I mean at least I accuse him.
06:22:45 I'm not about if any significant change in it for London.
06:22:47 But there are some new capabilities or Enhancements, Or Requirements, Impacting, Dca, for London, Release, so again, the Contributors who are going to be stepping up for London or not Act 2 Committers so That's, the other challenge, who were our Committers, have been Supporting
06:23:04 Independently, the some of the tasks needed for reviews, or contributions for DC, the Last few Releases.
06:23:10 So it's not like they they are heavily involved.
06:23:13 Kitty Since Coca-cola, or the Parabola.
06:23:17 So yeah, so we have based on the use cases, the DC, Impacts have changed over time. Right?
06:23:21 So whichever use case and own app is taking priority for the police, those use case contributors have in the past I've been involved in DC, and it's always a evolving doors, so lot of based on the use case we have seen Corresponding companies or Sponsoring companies are
06:23:40 Vendors, getting actually engaged, but after after the use case subsides, then they they move on to different project.
06:23:46 So right now I know there is some interest coming from Dt.
06:23:49 Techam, and Cap Germany, but they are not. They're not been active in the previous releases.
06:23:54 So we'll have to see how how that goes.
06:23:57 Forward, London and Beyond
06:23:58 Of course, so for The, for The you know, for the guys who are you know, putting some some new requirements.
06:24:08 Please be more active to support the project, to to make this those requirements, you know, operational, otherwise if it would be difficult to to move on with the with with the particular, project, so the you know when desks, so if you have no low capability, to to run ptl that's fine, but
06:24:31 Let's support the Requirement Hey moving forward through the gates
06:24:36 Okay.
06:24:39 I'd like to do is you know, see the Projects kind of the said, a common practice of in their Weekly Meetings, reviewing release Management tasks because has I think you Mentioned Powell.
06:25:00 Earlier, or someone did that any of these tasks are pretty simple, they're just checked steps.
06:25:08 And they he reviewed and closed in a matter of minutes.
06:25:11 And so you know, most of our Project teams have regular weekly meetings, and so even if you don't have a ptl, if you have you know, 2 or 3 people, sitting around a Table look at a task you know, they can sort it out, among themselves, probably you know close them.
06:25:34 Yeah
06:25:33 Pretty quickly. rather than waiting for you know a ptl to to do the the work
06:25:40 So if I may suggest in the message you will be sending to the to.
06:25:45 This committers, list, per project maybe it's worth to suggest to to spend time on the upcoming meeting.
06:25:53 So riching those release management tasks and and trying to to to close them
06:26:01 I I guess this is where I'm a bit confused.
06:26:06 If projects are having their meetings, who's running the meeting.
06:26:18 Yes there's no ptl
06:26:21 Hurt this Communist.
06:26:21 I'm volunteering. We are communists. Right? So
06:26:28 A volunteer is doing this in normally, so so we would say so okay, in Om I'm I'm doing that mostly,
06:26:44 But we we also discussed too much it around Robin, kind of, but in most cases I'm doing an integration, is still of course, M.
06:26:56 How doing most most of the cases, but
06:27:00 It can be done without any leader.
06:27:05 Yeah, no, in in in, in around robinson, but the the response.
06:27:09 I'm sorry I just that was great thank you, made my day
06:27:17 The other thing that Tsc should consider, is whether we and and this may answer itself.
06:27:26 Because we may not be able to move forward, but whether we need to gate progress on the release until all of these tasks get done for these projects I don't currently have ptls, is that necessary or is there you know something else that we could do to maintain project forward progress.
06:27:52 On the release. And I don't. Think we need hands for that right now, but it's something to think about
06:28:03 So.
06:28:03 Yeah, you're right, so let's do the following please send the remains emails to those lists of committers let's see if you get feedback, from the Site, or progress for the upcoming Week with the release management Tasks, and to Let's Reserve Discussion Point for the next
06:28:23 Tc, on on doing some, you know, hmm decision. What what do we do with the process that they they cannot fulfill the tasks.
06:28:36 So, if the task will be managed by the Project team.
06:28:40 Probably this project would be not participate in the release, because it's not capable of oh, you. Know doing.
06:28:48 Can I think so things, Jira, for a few few minutes. If you cannot solve it. It means you have no resources or no capability to to move forward right
06:28:57 Yeah, in some cases, and the the Ptls and architects on this call can answer this better than I can.
06:29:09 But some projects have a lot of have many other components dependent on them.
06:29:18 And so it it it may be a situation where we're unable to
06:29:25 Just exclude them from the release. If you see what I mean
06:29:36 Right.
06:29:31 Oh, I know what you mean, but still we cannot discuss now health and our on what we would do if Project answers or not, let's, ask the projects, Let's see the answers and discuss next week with more, inputs, on if projects, were able to respond, or not okay,
06:29:46 Okay. Fair enough. Alright, so the upshot is that we are not there on M.
06:29:56 One, and so my recommendation is for the time being that we'd for one.
06:30:04 One week, if if we have to defer it again, then next week, then I think we're looking at having to move it into the New Year and Probably Shift the entire schedule
06:30:22 Yeah, exactly
06:30:26 Alright, that's it for yeah, go ahead.
06:30:27 You correct that. Could I I I know. I sorry. Just. I know I'm not I'm not a Tsc member, but could I recommend something in terms of the Ptl Committer Project. Process is that fixed is that is that Static, or or could that be amended
06:30:45 I, it. Yeah, the opera. It's it's interesting that you brought that up, because I was, Yeah, I I I'm wondering if there is one of the Reasons that We're, having trouble.
06:31:00 Getting folks is that the process is viewed as as being too onerous.
06:31:11 Obviously if we have projects for continuing to do development work is going on.
06:31:15 It's important. But if if folks aren't willing to step up it's because they're I think fearful of Taking on an Additional Workload is that kind of where you're going with this
06:31:27 A little bit, yeah, the overhead the overhead involved is is a little bit cumbersome, but ultimately, I know, I know it's part of magnesis, and and Others Kind of direction is that we we change the release process, etc. I think that the Ptl Role and also the
06:31:57 Yeah
06:31:44 Committers on a particular project it can, if a ptl drops you you have an issue, and I'm, I'm I'm kind of Singling At a and AI, here, because it's it's quite a core, component but also the committers on the Project it
06:32:01 It seems to land on a couple of people in a project to merge code, and it can be a little bit how do I say, yeah, I understand you can't have wild West and everybody merges.
06:32:16 Called really Nellie, but at the same time, if there's only one or 2 people that can merge code, and there are changes in requirements coming in on a project that can be also quite quite limiting but yeah, it's just that maybe maybe it's I don't know if
06:32:30 It's Dsc decision, or a complete redesign in terms of you.
06:32:36 Know Pto, the Committer Process. You know, and and you know that's just a my 2 cents, sorry
06:32:45 I I think you're I think you're right.
06:32:50 I mean, it's it's just the fact that we have been running on up for quite a while.
06:32:55 Now it's it's time I mean 5.
06:33:00 Nearly 6 years. It's it's time to have a look and see.
06:33:05 Does this sort of process meet our expectations? Is it sort of the right?
06:33:12 One to have in in in the present situation,
06:33:20 We should be open to that. And that's one of the Suggestions, and I have sent out the mail.
06:33:26 I'll talk about that later, in in the agenda.
06:33:30 Okay, thank you, Magnus
06:33:32 Yeah, just my 2 cents, onto, it one is do we take exit feedback, from stepping down.
06:33:41 Ptl to understand what was not working for them. What was working that would help us understand right?
06:33:50 This situation, and the second thing is do we know the user base of the component, right.
06:33:57 So is the component used heavily. If yes, then there should be someone stepping up.
06:34:03 Okay.
06:34:06 I, yeah, I think I think that's good input on on everybody's part.
06:34:14 Here I don't think that we have done exiting interviews.
06:34:20 If you will, for the outbound Ptls.
06:34:26 I think in many cases they does it either been moved off the Project and It's a pretty much from an internal management structure that you know you're no longer on the Project don't spend another second on the Project and they've been moved off or They've been moved Out of the
06:34:50 Company, or or what. So that isn't something that we've done, but it would be certainly an interesting interesting conversation to have for the Ptls that have stepped down but have remained active
06:35:10 If you happen to be in that particular demographic and would like to send the email to the Tsc list.
06:35:20 I think that would be highly valuable, if you're having to be on the call and hearing this
06:35:38 So.
06:35:37 Yeah, can, you this with Jay, yeah, right. I can, share my views on that?
06:35:43 I can send you an email offline, maybe. But yeah, I think the main reason as you pointed is the Change of internal assignments, and company prioritization, right but of course, I mean, there are a few things. Which can be optimized, I I I I can compile, them and send it to you right
06:35:59 Yeah yeah
06:35:59 Thank you. Vijay, there could be 2 things right one is reason for leaving and the second could be the feedback, or how it went in your tenure right.
06:36:07 What do. You see as we should stop, and what do, you see, as we should improve.
06:36:14 Yeah, yeah, understood, yep, okay.
06:36:19 Thank you.
06:36:23 Hmm.
06:36:22 Yeah vj, if you could send that to the to, to the Tsc list rather than just to me.
06:36:28 I think that's what you meant. But
06:36:34 Yeah
06:36:36 Thank you vj.
06:36:37 Thank you so, much. okay, David has typed in a vote here, I'll plunk it down and for moving the M.
06:36:52 One to next week. I will plunk it down into the chat
06:37:03 And away we go.
06:37:33 Okay, that is more than enough. I'm gonna go ahead and close it out
06:37:45 Alright.
06:37:45 And that's the greed.
06:37:50 Thank you and thank you for your input the full weekly release.
06:38:00 Report is linked here at the top of the box.
06:38:05 In case you're interested. Hey? Sent that out to last evening.
06:38:10 And unless there are any additional questions that's it for me can
06:38:21 Okay,
06:38:26 So then moving on.
06:38:35 Thank you.
06:38:38 Which window and I'm looking at it is this one click,
06:38:53 Oh, that's just the I hate I hate. When I do. That
06:39:09 So relange want to talk a little bit about
06:39:15 Yes, and days. Yeah, it's
06:39:17 The Imman, 426
06:39:22 See, I man 4, 26. Did you say
06:39:25 Yep.
06:39:26 Yeah, I, believe I can talk about that one month
06:39:27 Okay, yes, that's Kevin, that's my mind.
06:39:31 Cool. Thank you, Kevin, go
06:39:36 No, no worries. I actually, yeah. So we wanted to reach out to the community about this, ticket, a we have a on the past Couple of days, Identified some a well, multiple actual, multiple Jenkins, jobs it's, still having references, to all releases, for example like istanbul, a
06:40:00 Franford, and some even very old a releases, so all of those references great I job for each of them, and that translates to increasing the Bill Considerably and there is a specific case of a Jenkins Jobs, for test Suite that actually consume a lot of Resources and the Bill
06:40:26 increase I'm not, so we have a couple of topics. Here.
06:40:33 The first one will be we would like to know about specifically about those test suits jobs.
06:40:38 It. Currently those, are a configure to run every 4 h.
06:40:43 So we'll like, to know, if that's still intended.
06:40:47 If there is a a chance to remove them to be on demand instead of running every 4 h, because the way it is, it is is increasing the bill a lot.
06:40:59 So what we did immediately to stop Daddy increasing the villages, to remove that a those tested jobs for the old Releases, and we only left for the Master Branch so We'll Like to know if for now on we can a update, those jobs to be run on demand or if the community, still wants to
06:41:20 Run them every every 4 h. That will be our very first topic.
06:41:34 Sorry is anyone
06:41:35 To be honest, I don't see a reason to run it every 4 h.
06:41:38 But maybe somebody could drink an argument.
06:41:44 Is there, someone.
06:41:43 And I think we yeah, sorry. Bye
06:41:57 Marshall, we're having a problem. Hearing you
06:41:46 No, no, no, good. I'll send that to someone is that green
06:42:02 I could hear myself well.
06:42:04 Oh, okay, is it better like, that will you change anything
06:42:07 Yes, for me, at least
06:42:09 Okay, so I'm just saying that if someone disagree on on the they're moving
06:42:24 Is quite forward, branches
06:42:28 I think it's the name here is misleading, and what is I think well, this is like here is we are missing.
06:42:38 An enough life process in on up. Because if you know which branches are out and of life, you can directly modify in revenge, or you can remove it and ensure the tags in the tech list related to so my accommodation, here will be not to change the
06:43:00 Trigger, but see, basically to remove the jobs
06:43:06 And also, maybe on a. PC. Must be clear about which punches are enough. Life or not
06:43:16 I think policy is quite clear. We we have one release. And and my mind is one maximum, nothing more
06:43:23 Yeah
06:43:24 So it's just about cleaning zoom, so tag, least in in Ca management.
06:43:32 And there's, a project, as
06:43:37 No
06:43:32 Okay, but do you see any reason. Cedric to to to run the the any, jobs, every every 4, h, is there, any requirements
06:43:40 If I if I take an and you get as an example. Here, I think it's basically a missing clean right
06:43:49 Summers. Maybe it's not just because nobody Kings or jobs
06:43:53 Yeah, yeah, so we need to do the cleanup. Here, right?
06:43:57 Exactly. Exactly. So you must define, clearly an enough life, process.
06:44:06 So.
06:44:02 And then to apply it on sa management or here, so the question is more in case of Fun Tests, for instance, we are maintaining all the branches, and the project itself because of you and users so if there is no such case in own up it's very simple just about if the jobs are well, written it's just about
06:44:21 Cleaning a couple of tag list in the Gdp
06:44:29 So events the job is useless. It's not about changing the the figure from every 4 h to manual, manual triggering it just.
06:44:45 Okay, so who do this task.
06:44:51 Who's responsibility, is it
06:44:39 I I will see basically remove the jobs itself.
06:44:56 Alright.
06:44:58 Same management to you. So it's Cla management commit
06:45:04 But who's a video for the test suit, repository.
06:45:08 We I mean, yeah, we can help making the change from moving those shops.
06:45:16 Test suite is a something that's managed under the the context of the integration team.
06:45:25 So it's headless
06:45:14 But we might need a plus one, anyways from from the pti
06:45:29 So the Test sweet it's right. So I think we have discussed this the issue is a little bit as I remember that we have.
06:45:40 Let's say a changes in the test cases and Test Scripts, and so on.
06:45:48 They have. Been. I think, therefore, the Whenever there was a change done, it will automatically, let's say, I think they that was what what I think was.
06:46:01 Was Implemented by by Morgan at that time, so that all the changes in the test suites are automatically triggered or in in the Triggering and not a New Docker, Container is created every once once a Day or something like that so that in the next daily Chain, then
06:46:21 Automatically, these new Test cases are executed. I think we today discussed also with Viaka, and also Mikhail, where that it's can be avoided, so that but then we'll have then really to think or remember that whenever there is a test, let's say changed or added.
06:46:41 or something like that that this has to be then triggered manually otherwise it will not be included in the next test.
06:46:49 Run. So I think it can be put to manual. But then we'll need to whatever document this, that this has to be done in a manual face to do that so at least for the test, suite, right
06:47:08 So there's yeah, let me one of the things is there's some real dollar and sense things here that would that we need to look at in terms, of this so what is the the recommendation, from from the tsc
06:47:37 If if you may, could I get some days to check the jobs and to reach with no go, if needed, I think it's pretty it's also a bit pretty trivial.
06:47:48 So I just need one day or 2 to look at to look at that
06:47:52 Okay, thank you, sir.
06:47:53 So you can put in. You can put an action on my name
06:47:59 Thank you, sir.
06:48:08 Oh!
06:48:15 I'm going to get to Ggb, first yes, and check with what if needed Log Logan sorry you
06:48:31 Does that Work
06:48:40 Thanks Cedric.
06:48:47 So, just to wrap up this topic. If I just, also wanted to to mention that for the rest of the a Project a besides, we proactively created the Gary changes to remove the the references to All branches so a Couple of minutes ago I sent an email to the Pdl distribution
06:49:08 List, with all, the Gary changes that we credit. So we will appreciate if the Pdls can go to those, let me get re changes and share their review.
06:49:20 So we can proceed to merge them. And once those changes are merged.
06:49:25 The Jenkins jobs for all Branches will be removed
06:49:34 And Kevin. If there is no ptl, some commiter could do it, or it must be ptl
06:49:44 Okay. Okay, thank you.
06:49:48 So committers aren't on the Ptl distribution.
06:49:37 Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, you're right. It. It will be just a a commuters a in general, can do that
06:49:53 So
06:49:59 Okay, cool. Thank you.
06:50:10 Can you do your mind to check if the phone, the ptl distribution is the committers from those projects where we have no pts, not least just to ensure that we have a communication, that would Hello, we received by the way, the people who could act
06:51:11 Okay.
06:51:11 Thank you, Kenny
06:51:20 Okay, anything else, or release management.
06:51:26 Yes, please. I'm aware that a bunch of verified jobs are failing today.
06:51:32 That's affecting all sorts of oh, well, it's called the World Pain, basically
06:51:39 I thought we debugged this today. And I know the issue is is actually an incompatibility between latest version of talks and tox pi and it looks like and it's fine on the Default Python 3, point 6, in the version of up to 1,804,
06:51:53 We're running, however, if you move To Python 3, dot, 7 and 3 dot 8.
06:51:59 This problem, comes out because talks. The talks version that's installed with 4 0 2, very latest.
06:52:04 Release. And then you get someone resolvable issues with talks pi am, so we've also discovered as a missing module.
06:52:11 Dependency, for pi and needs to be added. So there's 2 things that need to put in as a fix today, which is make sure the Pi Modules Installed and we need to pinned Cocks, to the earlier, version, the same, one as being used under
06:52:26 Python, 3, dot, 6, which Is Tox, 3, 27, one, and I've got a world of testing in sandbox.
06:52:33 Today. I've done a bunch of testing and Docker containers.
06:52:35 And the issue is actually isn't the poison version.
06:52:38 It's it's the latest, version of talks and pione, and I I think, 5 from 3 to 6 has some pins, dependency that means you don't get the latest version Talks but in Python 3 and 7 3 8.
06:52:49 You do. And then, this problem surfaces. So I spent pretty much all day today, troubleshooting it.
06:52:56 I'm just gonna grab some of my colleagues after this call, and We'll see if we put fixing for this to get the Verified Jobs Working again, but I've had a number of people contact me today, about this from Own App Liam Viakara and to
06:53:09 Honesty too. So I'm I'm aware that we need to get this fixed quickly.
06:53:16 But I think coming debugged it. We know what the issue is. So I'll compare notes in my range tolerate. When we get off this correct
06:53:22 Yeah, thanks. Matt, for looking, at No. Negotiations.
06:53:28 I. Just I thought it was just something.
06:53:30 I was doing. So it's no, it's not. It's not a big panic.
06:53:30 Yeah, no, and obviously, it's
06:53:33 We're not waiting to release or anything else.
06:53:34 That's good. It's just when when the Verified Jokes fair affects everybody.
06:53:39 So it it's it's quite visible and appreciate I mean.
06:53:42 We could just roll back yesterday's change. But now I've got the point of debugging it.
06:53:44 I think actually the fix is fairly straightforward. It was the fact that it was all unknown this morning. When it all kicked off the that meant I had to do a bit of digging but I'm like totally Confident we found the course so i'll just see if we get fixing as IP
06:54:02 Before we move on, can we talk about 24, 9.
06:54:05 O, 6, I I linked it there.
06:54:09 In the Rel inch, agenda, right, there.
06:54:15 Yeah, it's 24, 9, 6. Do you mind putting it up.
06:54:21 Take a look at it.
06:54:24 Yes, this is related to the Tsc decision to the Conditional Approval of Cone sign Off.
06:54:52 Can. You keep story.
06:54:34 It was conditioned on finishing up some tasks, some of those tasks or assigned to Dan timid, and when Dan was trying to clean that up he he ran into some fish, so just spend it back and Forth most of this week about it but it is tied to the release
06:54:55 And he keeps scrolling down David just go down a little bit, further, except for feeling this, is the very issue we're talking about yes, this is the very issue We're talking about so Missing Module, named pi it's great I what I'll do is I'll just Grab this
06:55:08 Ticket, but I'm already, which number is it 24, 9, O 6.
06:55:12 This is exactly the problem, yeah. So we just discussed
06:55:15 Yeah, and just just note that Dan responded to this hour.
06:55:20 An hour ago, and he said, oh, whatever you guys did earlier at helped.
06:55:25 But he's getting a new failure, or a new error.
06:55:28 Okay.
06:55:26 Yeah, yeah, absolutely, well, I will update right now with the findings.
06:55:35 Yeah, no problem.
06:55:44 Okay.
06:55:48 Moving on, then
06:55:53 Rather than Pdf mode I'm going to share this just from Powerpoint.
06:55:58 Give me a second.
06:56:10 Okay, can you all see that
06:56:14 Yes, we can
06:56:15 Yes.
06:56:16 Yes.
06:56:27 Not yet to presentation, mode
06:56:23 Is it presentation, mode, or still looking at just the okay, well, we'll just if if this is readable we'll just leave it that way
06:56:34 That's fine
06:56:38 Okay, so, there's been a lot of discussion around
06:56:44 The portal next generation, project, that Deutsche Telecom has worked on internally, and they would, like to donate to own app, and There's been some Discussion, about process and and how it all Works, so hopefully, what i've got here will help clear that up first of all what are the Characteristics, of
06:57:06 A product, of a product, as a project, prudge prud sheep, for pro project, project,
06:57:17 If these are true, I qualifies to be a project, so long term effort.
06:57:22 There's Value Delivered Incrementally across Releases
06:57:27 The development is rationalized based upon clear benefits.
06:57:34 To a broader user base it's got a clearly defined scope.
06:57:39 That can be leveraged. across multiple user multiple use cases.
06:57:45 It needs a dedicated Central Request Repository for the Code Deliverance.
06:57:55 And in this context, it's looked at as a top level repo, not a child of another Project repo.
06:58:04 If that makes sense
06:58:08 It's going to be a community project it's going to be worked on by the community.
06:58:12 And you've got folks that all have similar experience in a particular area.
06:58:20 It's not a project. If it's a one, and done type of Exercise which you know in general, is is a bad idea, regardless, but it's definitely not that if the if the Expected Output is going to Benefit, only a Particular Entity, and not the Community or in or Industry, in
06:58:51 General if Scott, a Vague Vague Scope, or if it's too broadly Scoped,
06:59:02 It it's just a collection of stuff for a single use case.
06:59:10 That's just kind of a jumbled mess
06:59:14 It can be done without having a dedicated code repository at a top level.
06:59:20 If the Work is only going to be within a a particular team, it's not gonna be community sourced.
06:59:27 Or, if you've got people with vastly different areas of expertise required to do it
06:59:37 What's. The proof of concept This is basically something, that we're doing to demonstrate functionality, they're, Usually small and slightly focused, They're always Delivered as Unsupported and they may Be Completely, Unfunctional when the release comes Out, There's
07:00:00 somebody sponsoring it for the feature that person acts as spokesperson, and handles, the Checkpoints and things, along those lines, as far as requirements, go.
07:00:13 It's Reviewed by the Impacted Subcommittees, it's Reviewed by the Impact of Ptls, Just like Any other any any other Request going into into the the Workload of the Community and it Should have Different Resources, from Delivering What the Tsc is
07:00:40 Approved to be actually be in the release for poc.
07:00:44 The code may be contributed with they targeted release, but it can't be integral to the release.
07:00:52 They can't block the release. They can't create backward, incompatibilities.
07:00:57 Can't, Create Projection, We're We're, We're We're, We're We're Great Regressions, and it Shouldn't Pollute, the Main Code Repo
07:01:12 So any questions about what I've covered there thus far.
07:01:21 Okay, dope.
07:01:21 Nope.
07:01:24 So there's 3 ways to go about it.
07:01:25 Yeah, Matt, sorry can I have us a bit slow there.
07:01:29 But okay, continue. I, I I think you will answer my question and the following thanks
07:01:35 Okay, So going. About a poc, there's Kenny's view of it.
07:01:42 Is there's 3 ways to go about it, The traditional one is a poc.
07:01:50 Is basically executed within the existing project structure with no Changes other than hey?
07:01:58 We're introducing some new code here and we're following the Poc Process.
07:02:05 And it it you know, gets delivered. they're also pocs that can be intended as a potential project spin off, the work is done, within one of the Existing projects, and if That's Successful There's it's you to there being enough, differentiation that it can be a
07:02:26 Standalone, If the Poc proves out to be successful.
07:02:33 If I'm not mistaken cps may have taken that approach
07:02:44 I don't I I'm going from memory there the third would be a matter of Donated seed code.
07:02:52 So one of the members of the community says, hey? We've got something we've been working on internally.
07:02:57 We think this provides value. we actually want to propose this as a new project to the Tsc.
07:03:05 It follows, the the Project Approval Process, the Seed Codes then delivered to it?
07:03:12 Who does the the verifies, the cleansing and the merging into a newly created repo, a newly created top level? Repo.
07:03:22 And then that functionality is introduced with the next release,
07:03:29 All, of the typical poc provisions would apply to that as this is 8, a a functional product within the context of own app and the own app Project, Structure, the the Release next release plus one at that point all of the standard Participation thanks would apply and it would just go simply go in
07:03:55 As a new would simply go on his a new supported Feature into the main Line code base
07:04:06 So questions on what I have here.
07:04:20 Okay. Dok.
07:04:22 Yeah. No. I have a question. Kenny latest always.
07:04:26 I mean I don't follow this exactly I mean.
07:04:31 What option must be that you put it into a and existing project
07:04:39 Yep.
07:04:39 And you don't spin it off
07:04:41 Right there.
07:04:42 Yeah, but that's the poke
07:04:48 I mean, just oh, do you mean that this that you would you take this poking and make it into an integral part of a a project?
07:04:57 Is that what you mean with number one, okay, I did. Yeah, now, I get it.
07:05:00 Yes. Yep, yeah. And if it's if it's happening within an existing project.
07:05:10 The ptl has complete authority to go and create a new repo, within the context of their project.
07:05:17 Right, yeah.
07:05:18 Right, so but that's a child, repo, not a top level, repo
07:05:21 Hmm, okay. Understood.
07:05:28 So, where are we with Portal Ng? This has been extensively socialized from my perspective.
07:05:36 Presentations to the Tsc to the Ptls, there's a draft proposal in place which the links there I will drop that into the Chat window for everybody to take a look at
07:05:57 Right there. If you wanna go, take a look at that. there have been conversations with the Architecture subcommittee.
07:06:05 I know that there's a formal view scheduled for the Thirteenth, the links, for the Architecture Subcommittee.
07:06:14 There,
07:06:17 And and what we are looking at is new project, creation.
07:06:21 Here, not talking about the Poc, but creating a new project at at the top, level so i'll go through the Architecture Review, at that point, the formal project proposal would be submitted would just simply be added to the Tsc Agenda at least 2 Weeks in Advance the
07:06:51 Pro proposal would move from the draft Directory to the new Proposal Directory and an email would be set to the Tsc, list notifying hey?
07:07:00 This new proposal is up for for approval in 2 weeks at the Tsc.
07:07:10 To make every everyone aware of it, so from from my perspective.
07:07:15 The process is being followed, as it should and then if if the project is approved by the the the tsc, what would happen is it would just follow this this model here the initial release.
07:07:32 Of this would be in the context, of the Poc, second release of it would be just part of the the Standard, Release and and and going into the main branch
07:07:50 Does that provide the Clarification folks have been looking for
07:08:01 At least for me is I was. As I was presenting it in the Tc. Together.
07:08:06 Some weeks ago. That was my understanding. What you're presenting here.
07:08:11 Yes.
07:08:14 So we want a proof of concept and we were told. First, we have to go for a project, proposal, and to have the project accepted. Before we can get any place in the repository.
07:08:33 Yep, the and and that that guidance came from me for everybody's knowledge that may not be aware of this, and the reason, is because this from my perspective was significantly different than the Existing Portal Project That's, Out there and I think that Retiring the Old Project
07:09:03 Launching. This is a new project that would then go on through the Standard Life Cycle of Open App would be contributing release after release to Me is the Correct Approach I don't see this sitting in to an Existing Repo Structure.
07:09:25 So the the the folks, at dt have been following from my perspective.
07:09:35 Pretty much following the process to the letter for new Project creation and the reasoning new Project is necessary is because a new top Level region is being requested
07:09:55 So I I think that the the work being done here, they're waiting on a repo to get created.
07:10:03 So they can provide. The same code is is basically where we are if I'm not mistaken.
07:10:10 So.
07:10:10 Yeah. Al right. Looking forward, to do that good, alright
07:10:16 Okay, so whose job is it
07:10:21 Whose job is. It for well, it's
07:10:24 For for bringing up this report. So they so Dt team, could bring their code and move forward
07:10:33 The the girth, following the pro, the process here.
07:10:39 So after the review just needs to go on the Tsc Agenda, 2 weeks out in advance, of that and then all You'll vote on it
07:11:00 Yeah, but who is
07:10:59 Okay, question to that. You see team, do. We need some extra 2 weeks for for doing the vote.
07:11:04 I think we had already the presentation right. So more more than 2 weeks ago.
07:11:07 Yeah, exactly
07:11:09 So that means I would say if we go for that
07:11:15 I I guess it is the task, for the for the advantage.
07:11:18 Yeah
07:11:18 Right so to create and the the structure on what? Request.
07:11:25 So our main project, and maybe some some sub projects for that
07:11:33 And the objections from the Tc Team to move on with the Letting, the Eleph Engineering to to to build this new report for the native generation, Portal
07:11:56 Okay.
07:11:55 Okay, no objections. So shall we shall we vote or we are goes to to move on on this
07:12:00 So we are voting on just just so I'm clear voting on creation of the new repo, and then the formal project approval. Following the process that vote would come at a later. Date. Or we're, doing both right now either way is fine with me okay.
07:12:21 I think it should be it should be both. There is no really need to vote twice let's make a bundle
07:12:32 If possible.
07:12:33 Okay.
07:12:31 Okay, so what I will do let me type, this up
07:12:43 Let me.
07:12:47 What I'm gonna do? Is take the
07:12:52 Yeah, let me type up the vote. Here. So, give me 1, s.
07:12:59 My apologies for going slow on this I'm going to stop actually stop that share and just pop over to the other window and type, type, it in there, sir, but see it as I type, it
07:13:17 Okay.
07:13:22 And then correct me. If I'm wrong
07:14:08 Let's see do. I still have that in my history recently viewed phone.
07:14:15 Yes, I do.
07:14:19 Okay, so does the Tsc approve the creation of Portal Ng as a new own app project, as defined in the project proposal
07:14:31 And and so creation of the report right for this project
07:14:36 Yes, that implies, the creation, yeah, that implies, the creation of the repo.
07:14:40 Okay.
07:14:47 Okay, I'm putting that into the chat
07:15:00 Hey boom!
07:15:10 Hello yeah.
07:15:36 I'll give it a couple more seconds.
07:15:53 Okay, I'll go and close it out.
07:16:02 And congratulations
07:16:07 And Welcome Portal M. G.
07:16:12 The own App community.
07:16:17 Yeah
07:16:20 You
07:16:19 It's been hard work on on on the part of Dt.
07:16:24 Thank you so much. I'm super excited about this
07:16:25 You know it's time for uplouse, right. You have an uplaws. Can they do some way for some things
07:16:27 Yeah
07:16:33 If not next time, we will bring some applause.
07:16:37 Yeah
07:16:39 Okay, guys, we have 2, topics, right, one, topic, is that liaison, that magma's proposed and the other one is that ask for for our guidance, on you know, removing those to to items from helm and from owen I, think the the
07:17:03 Second, one, is pretty straightforward, yes.
07:17:09 Do. I do. Okay, which one is additional one.
07:17:05 Sorry pebble, sorry pebble, I've get another I have 2 items, but the update on the task Force
07:17:17 Oh, okay, that's false. Okay, so we have okay.
07:17:22 Those 3 items
07:17:21 But I can, I can. I can. I can wait for the Liaison statement that's not diligent.
07:17:28 Okay operationally, can we agree that the Fiatra could remove Apps and Portal from Rm and no Objections
07:17:41 Those are how maintain projects right and I don't see reason to to keep them in hand.
07:17:49 And oh, I'm but maybe there's some other reasons that you could share.
07:17:55 Otherwise, Let's agree on removing that
07:18:02 Okay, i'm gonna mark that as agreed
07:18:06 I hear no objections.
07:18:07 The the so I I know we're we're shorts on.
07:18:10 Time. But yeah, I just, I I maybe wanted to just discuss around what the process, like in terms, of like, if I look in the documentation at the Moment like Vid is still included in in the current documentation, and I think Upc is also so the there may be Yeah, okay, this is purely, specifically to
07:18:31 do it the O mound charts, which is essentially what gets released and or most end users would use so i'm focusing on that end.
07:18:43 But there probably is other trickle down tasks to remove these these projects that are on maintain slash, not part of a release for quite a while now
07:18:54 Okay, so I propose the following that's we it will be good to Involve Thomas I'm not sure if Thomas is today from the documentation with us so so Let's part.
07:19:09 The the topic of what should be in the documentation as an as a as a next next Tc.
07:19:14 Okay. Yeah. Yeah.
07:19:17 Agenda. So we could invite Thomas and would have like maybe offline discussion on this.
07:19:20 So we could agree on the outcomes, right
07:19:27 Yeah
07:19:24 I think that I can do also internally with him. So I think please not today with me with us here but definitely eppsy is at the moment not in also not in the let's.
07:19:37 Say umbrella don't so no reference to that, and I think also not a bit is also not included.
07:19:42 So Most things are already let's say who does it has to be checked, whether we have some, some guide, some guides, or some some let's say, in the main document.
07:19:56 So some hints for or some some some descriptions, where with would be for example included this we would need to remove them from the documentation point of View.
07:20:08 But this can be, done. Then or or Thomas can do, and with help with myself, and so on.
07:20:14 So we can do that. Yeah.
07:20:14 And thank you for Raising this point figure
07:20:14 Okay, but just yeah, but just just in relation to it. Sorry.
07:20:18 But the documentation is is included in the list.
07:20:21 It's included in Latin. Okay, okay
07:20:23 Yeah, and has been for you. Know, way, before it's actually been stopped.
07:20:29 Yeah, yeah, okay
07:20:27 Or removed as prior to release. So yeah, th, the probably is cleaning up there to be done
07:20:32 Yeah
07:20:35 Okay, let's do it
07:20:37 Right.
07:20:39 Good thanks.
07:20:40 Okay, thank you fetra
07:20:40 And the and yeah, adjust to my members. So in the future, so within this release that will be more to come.
07:20:47 Yeah, so as you know, we have the requirements to get rid of Af, so this is one of the umbrella requirements, so that will for example, be also removed, most likely from the documentation and from the Rf, orm held Charts.
07:21:02 But this comes then later in the in the game. So we will check then the dependencies, also some other smaller parts, which we might remove like console, and other stuff like a testing stuff, which is not not, maintained anymore.
07:21:18 Within the Olymp Project itself. So we will most likely then also come with in the next weeks or months with more charts, which we might remove and also from document
07:21:32 Perfectly, makes sense. Thank you, andreas, okay, guys. Let's move on. so I I give you the floor
07:21:37 Hmm, yeah, okay, I can. I can say, sorry, I I can say, 20 s, I can spend on the liaison statement, so it's coming from Fry.
07:21:51 Itut and they are doing, some kind, of mapping of the the various standards and specifications from the Standards, Parties, and from from and We are also invited, and It's We Don't have any Own Up Sort of Material There in their Repository, and I
07:22:17 I we don't have to look at the at the document.
07:22:22 Since we don't have that much time. So I just wanted you to be aware of that.
07:22:27 And someone is interested to to have a look and and we can decide and try to work out what in what form.
07:22:35 We announce what we have from from ownup, and what we want to to share with this, task, force in in IoT, but let's let's bring it up next time.
07:22:48 So I'll go to the next one.
07:22:48 Yeah let's make an action point for everyone to to review this document.
07:22:53 Yup.
07:22:55 Hmm.
07:22:53 Right. I understand that we should take a look, offline, and then to to have a discussion point on what we want to share with it right
07:23:01 Yeah. Excellent idea. Thanks.
07:23:05 And then.
07:23:03 Okay, okay, Kenny, could you please, partner, this action, point, for for all, Tsc, members, just to
07:23:19 Okay, next, one. Is I sent out the mail to with this content to the mainstream.
07:23:29 May list, and also to the ptl may listen to the Requirement Subcommittee mail.
07:23:34 List, I think most mostly sort of the the ones that are outside of the Tc.
07:23:40 That is is mostly affected by this, and it isn't as a follow-up from the meeting and the some, these Session I had in in se in Seattle, so I bringing up a few things reason is actually to be coming into action and sort, of have actionable tasks so when it comes
07:24:04 To Streamlined release Process I think it's time to review the the release process.
07:24:11 As we talked about before and present. One is 2 to 3 years old, and and much has happened.
07:24:17 The proposal is that I call for workshop.
07:24:20 Where we look at streamlining, and to relieve the Admin burden from Ptls and Requirement Owners, and and Sureened the Timeline Hopefully so I'm looking for Volunteers, and you can Send a a Note to Me or You can if you get this you this Mail.
07:24:44 if you a part of this mainstream, my list, you can you can send everybody, because I want I want that people that that wants to sort of contribute to this and and that has sort of ideas, and but also I mean experience from from what with the release process next one.
07:25:10 Is streamlined requirement process that's something that team has brought up and and has looked at this and and my proposal here is to team it to suggest how to review and possibly this could be in conjunction with the with the above a process review and I
07:25:35 don't know team. If you have any spontaneous comment on this
07:25:43 Yeah, I can obviously provide a proposal.
07:25:58 Okay.
07:25:50 But I think it just make sense, to to kind of combine, it with the there's a one kind of is part of kind, of sub part of that but but I will work on that on the Requirement.
07:26:05 Process streamlining, proportion
07:26:07 Okay, thanks.
07:26:11 No, no! The Next sort of action, task how to strengthen the components in order to be useful standalone as also, without the the full owner, platform, because that's a Consumption model that that that many Uses, of own up Use so Bian brought this up in his Session in Seattle, I think
07:26:33 it was the last for the next last session, he that in the in the on the day, and and and many people, had sort of traveled already, and so so but it's available to look, at and he has also created the page, call on up Mainstream Architecture where he Lists, Targets.
07:26:54 goals and and my Assumption, or whatever. When I've talked to to be honest as that, is going to drive that together with chucker in the architecture group.
07:27:06 Oh, subcommittee! Sorry then, how where's the Demo for Logical Audiences?
07:27:15 I'd like to to just show you a couple of very good examples.
07:27:19 So Kg. Wang presented the demo at the the Team forum am sto.
07:27:25 If information is change meeting on on this seventh of November and and this the slides are are available, put in the link here, and the Henry, you Presented an own up Base Demo actually this Monday in the Layer, 1 2 3 world Congress that I Attended earlier this Week and That's also very good
07:27:50 Except, I don't think that that material is sort of a available, since it's a conference.
07:27:58 And you have to pay a fee, and so on. But I'll ask you, Henry, to make that available also in inside the own up
07:28:08 Yeah, and then was when it comes to external collaborations.
07:28:12 I would like to highlight that there is an ongoing meeting between known up and and all.
07:28:20 Run, a software community led by by Martin, Kiribski and John Kinney, and I think maybe that can be used as a model for collaboration with with other projects and and communities, but it's it's, it's, based on their sort of personal Engagement and and their interest in in
07:28:41 Sort of running, a a a joint collaborator, so jo, jo joint work between the Oc and and their ownup
07:28:51 Then there are value augmentation that we might want to to make tasks out of, and and also use the group, but I thought I Would sort of We Don't have to have a complete set of tasks, already we can Fire off on the the once what that we have so I'm
07:29:15 Looking, for for for volunteers here on the first streamlined release process, and I think that we might you say an existing meeting on this maybe we can make a special sort of Tc session on this or a special ptl session dedicate a a a meeting that
07:29:38 We already have in the in the agenda, because it's difficult to push in new meetings, and and then we can move forward in this any comments feedback on this
07:30:03 Hmm.
07:29:57 Yeah, definitely, make sense, I, support this idea, so we answer your email, let me hope, because it brings a lot of value.
07:30:23 Thanks. I I think there are I think it'll get a a a a number of volunteers.
07:30:34 And I flunk, the the link, to join the Mailing List.
07:30:40 If folks aren't on it, into the chat
07:30:41 Hmm, okay. Thanks.
07:30:47 That was well, for now
07:30:10 You know. Take off the murder from the Pts, and simplify the process. So it would be easy to move on with the limited resources we have
07:30:52 Okay, we are up against the time. So 2 quick announcements, the last Ptl meeting of the Calendar year will be On Monday, and the last Tsc Meeting, of the Calendar year will be next week, on Thursday, other Than that Powell was your Permission on go ahead and close out
07:31:16 The meeting.
07:31:20 Permission Granted any topics you would like to address for the next week, Agenda I'm apart from the ones that we already Discussed today.
07:31:28 And we have some action points
07:31:34 For me personally, no. But if folks are interested, please remember you can go in and add things to the to the Tsc Calendar, yourselves.
07:31:47 Okay. Yeah.
07:31:46 Theocracy, Issue, Aside
07:31:54 Okay. Thank you. Everybody have a good weekend
07:31:53 Okay. Sounds, good. Thank you guys, good, meeting, thank you, bye, bye